Pastor Cristian Ionescu from Elim Pentecostal Church in Chicago is the main architect of the global pro-Bodnariu/anti-Barnevernet movement. He is a Delight in Truth friend and a man of integrity who used the Bodnariu case as a spearhead to mobilize the world against the Norwegian CPS. He is in Norway to meet with Norwegian authorities this week, and he gave an interview to the top Romanian newspaper Adevarul.
He was asked:
“What will you continue to do? Norwegian authorities promised to re-analyze cases where children were removed by Barnevernet.”
“I am not patient with Norway. They should have given the [Bodnariu] kids back long ago. All this procrastination proves that we are dealing with a system in survival mode, which will damage itself if it admits its mistake. It is an evil system, and evil cannot be reformed. It must be destroyed.
This system committed more abuse than it did good. It exploits crisis to create greater crisis. We are not here to represent a strategy. We do not play tic tac toe with Norway. Strategy is out the door now. We tell Norway what we will do and we will do it. We proved that we are credible.
Everything we announced, we did and we will do. If Norway does not hurry up and give the kids back, there will be an avalanche of actions. We hope we do not get to May 30th-June 2nd when [Barnevernet] is preparing a court hearing. God forbid that there will be an unfavorable decision for Bodnariu, because there will be protests and actions against Norway that Norway cannot imagine. We came [to Norway] to open their imagination and tell them exactly what will happen. If they want us to fight against the image of Norway abroad, then they should keep the kids.
This is a fight of two painful realities: Norway’s pain of recognizing it’s mistake and giving the kids back, or Norway’s pain of international shame. Which painful reality will prevail will be the one which will determine Norway’s action. We must make the international shame so painful that Norway will resort to returning the kids.
If the children are not returned, then we will communicate our actions at that time. All countries involved in this protest will have a blueprint of action, and this will cause great headaches for Norway. Once we get this going, it will be unstoppable.”
Interview here: adev.ro/o6psbm
Reblogged this on agnus dei – english + romanian blog and commented:
Thank you so much for giving us a synopsis of this major interview in the ENGLISH Language. This is an extremely encouraging interview with some strong statements and it also gives us a glimpse of a strong plan which is very encouraging, as we do not want to stop the momentum until the children are returned to their parents…
It is like a punch straight to the bully’s nose. We will wait to see if CI’s visit to Norway will have an impact. How much does the govt of Norway care about its image abroad?
May God open doors and ears. This is unprecedented, what pastor Ionescu is doing. Even though they consider the pastor an adversary, he is an important one at that and I believe he will be able to sway a lot of people who thought differently until now. In alte cuvinte, o sa aduca lumina in locuri unde a fost doar intuneric pana acum. We all better lift him up in our prayers that God gives him wisdom and open doors everywhere he goes.
Joe Johnson (Evangelical Alliance) delievered a good Anti-Barnevernet message at the protest in Glasgow (Scotland) on April 16, 2016:
Cowers editors from so called “Christian” magazine Dagen.no must watch this video to see how “indoctrinated” are our children and how “extremist” we are 🙂
Yes the Christian magasine dagen.No has also politicals there called KrF a Christian part in the Norwegian gowerment but that KrF is a smal part in the gowerment unfortenly but the leader in that Christian political parties KrF hes aftername hareide i think i must say something to the leader Erna Solberg that leads the hole state very, very soon now before it all to late for all these childrens the bornariu children and all the other children that this horrible barnevernet has take for real god families that just had been need litle helt from other familiymembers i think that this horrible things barnevernet. Have been doping in so many year must stop as fast as posible in a way that is god for the children i have a friend my self that barnevernet have taken her son for over 5 years ago and my god friend has lost all hope she se her son 3 times ever year 3 hours ever time and my friend is not allow to show feelinngs then her son is there not slow to show any thing other feelings that happynes but my friend is not alle to show that my friend is Sad becourse my friend has get a mesage that it causes trouble for the fosterparents after my friend has been together in 3 hour with the son this system is a craped shit and the gowerment in noway must shot it down now
Re the audio file of my impromptu speech which you posted above this post:
I would like to make it clear that am not and have never been associated with the Evangelical Alliance. I attended the April 16th Event in Glasgow purely on my own initiative because as a father and grandfather (and the eldest of a family of five who were brought up by God-fearing parents), I believe that a great injustice has been done to the Bodnariu children and their parents. I came to Glasgow to show my support for them in their fight to have the children returned. I spoke up in support of the Bodnariu’s as an individual evangelical Scottish Christian, because there were so few Scottish Christians present and I wanted to let my Romanian brothers and sisters in Christ know, that, notwithstanding the poor turnout by Scottish Christians, there are many in Scotland who believe that Marius and Ruth Bodnariu are good parents and that many of us are praying fervently that their children will be returned to them.
May God bless you and give you wisdom in your efforts to right the wrong that has been done to this lovely family.
Your brother in Christ,
Welcome to Delight in Truth, and thank you for supporting our movement.
Hi Jo Johnson,
thank you for the clarification. The information was provided by “Mariana”, the person who uploaded the video (it’s under the description section):
I’ll ask her to correct the info. We really appreciate your support for Bodnariu family.
May God Bless You!
You should be wise enough to understand that this will have no impact on the ongoing case, Mr. Prunean. I don’t understand how you can think in that way either – that a man coming from Chicago because of a certain case with one Christian Romenian should be altered in some way because this visitor has an opinion of Norway, Norwegians and the work and practise done by the CPS in Naustdal.
If the image of Norway is the only weapon the government easily can live with that – so the CPS – we – other than the 3 or 4 and their Councilman – have nothing to do with this case. We continue the work we do in our municipalities and hope Horne is awake and do some changes and priorities.
So, you understand that Horne is making changes, Knut. Do you know what those changes are? So far, after the recent demonstrations, her changes have been in the wrong direction.
You seem not to care about what the world thinks about your country. So be it.
Have Horne’s changes been in the wrong direction? I don’t think so. From the 01 th of April we can force help measures on families in some cases with the intention to prevent care order or to shorten the way for the child involved to a fosterhome. This forcing of help measures has yet to be tried out. Looks like progress from my window.
Horne has made a plan for a change for the responsibility of foster homes by taken them away from the state arena and handing it over to the municipalities. The thinking behind is that we know better than the state the family, the relatives, the friends and other possible to take the professional foster care for the child involved. In this way the child will not be moved from it’s known relations and surroundings. Looks like a progress from my window.
Horne has given foreign countries the possibility to attend in cases where some from their country is involved – if the private part involved think that’s ok – likewise give them the insight in the papers – this for the understanding and the support – but – of cause – no foreign country can interfer in an ungoing case. Looks like progress from my window.
“The thinking behind is that we know better than the state the family, the relatives, the friends and other possible to take the professional foster care for the child involved. In this way the child will not be moved from it’s known relations and surroundings.”
This may look like progress from your window, Knut, but I am familiar with your window.
This is typical doublespeak. I am all for more power to be given to the local levels in many areas including education. However, If all municipality CPS workers are trained like the ones I’ve seen in videos, only more damage will be caused. Horne is attempting to consolidate her power. By having control over many minions like you, and by keeping the state in the dark, she can do whatever she pleases.
You plan on turning over a new leaf when it comes to placement? You are not going to move the children from their known relations and surroundings? Please tell me when this begins to happen. I would like to hear some facts about children with real needs being placed with appropriate relatives. Until then, I will not hold my breath, because I wouldn’t be around long.
I agree with you, Rodi. Also I recommend Everybody to Read About Norway Stealing Kids, Then Tout ‘Democratic Socialism’:
e from knut- take foreign children yes, no problem , but no interference from foreign countries . no. ok when it all will be stopped for the G- d sake??
I see or heard no plan here. Nothing is going ti\o change because Mr. Ionescu ( Big Mouth??) is taking a trip to Norway talking to … who?
God is not a part in the ungoing case – mr. Ionescu either. The parts are just the parents and their lawyer and the CPS in Naustdal. If mr. Ionescu think he can influence the case with some sort of diplomacy I hope he is wrong – for in that case we end up in corruption.
I think our government understand that we can live with these kind of threats if the work we do in the CPS is done properly. I’m not sure in this case, but if Mr. Ionescu is in Norway just now he should be talking to the County Governour in Sogn og Fjordane. They are the ones that do the control of what the CPS in Naustdal is doing. He should be speaking with the Council man in Naustdal who has the control of the CPS ship in his municipal and his face tells me that he is prepared to go down with that ship if necessary – no child is coming voluntarily.
Threatning Norway and speaking in war tongues are of no impact – it only make the wall thicker. Diplomacy is wisdom, humility and understanding of who you are and how small your shoes are trampling in on Norwegian ground and speaking war language.
“God is not a part in the ungoing case.”
This show all of us how little you know your scriptures, Knut.
Then enlighten me, Chris – and I hope no atehists read this blog. If God is a legal part of this case – then the “why’s ” are coming to my .. ours .. with questions like.. “why do He allow this to happen .. for so long ..
Nice effort to create friction between me and atheists. Any semi-educated atheist knows that Christians believe that God knows all things:
“Little children, let us not love with word or with tongue, but in deed and truth. 19 We will know by this that we are of the truth, and will assure our heart before Him 20 in whatever our heart condemns us; for God is greater than our heart and knows all things.” 1 John 3: 18-20
You can’t hide from God in a courtroom, Knut.
“why do He allow this to happen .. for so long ..”
Here you are, a person who calls himself a Christian and you ask such a question? I can understand the atheist asking it but you? It is called the “problem of evil,” and it has been a theological discussion for ages.
It continually amazes me how man blames God for man’s behavior. If God hadn’t allowed man to have free will, love would not be a possibility. In order for love to be a possibility, hate has to also be possible. Otherwise, Knut would be a real robot and not the robotic-like human that he is. God is love and he frowns upon things like the incidents mentioned in this blog. Again and again, the Bible records of story after story of man falling from God’s grace only to be redeemed after repentance. Romans 1 discusses those who continually deny truth:
28 “And just as they did not see fit to acknowledge God any longer, God gave them over to a depraved mind, to do those things which are not proper, 29 being filled with all unrighteousness, wickedness, greed, evil; full of envy, murder, strife, deceit, malice; they are gossips, 30 slanderers, haters of God, insolent, arrogant, boastful, inventors of evil, disobedient to parents, 31 without understanding, untrustworthy, unloving, unmerciful; 32 and although they know the ordinance of God, that those who practice such things are worthy of death, they not only do the same, but also give hearty approval to those who practice them.”
God is a God of justice. The sins of the Barnevernet will be acknowledged in a much higher court some day. If someone calls me to the stand to be a witness, I will be happy to comply.
first of all please do not refer to an important Romanian Christian Leader, not only in the US where he resides, but around the world as well as being a ‘big mouth’. Your description of Mr. Ionescu is beneath what a public civil servant such as yourself should display in public debates. Mr. Ionescu has worked tirelessly on behalf of the Bodnariu family and once again, instead of engaging in the debate you start your comment by attacking the person instead of debating the issue with facts. Why all the animosity Mr. Nygard?
The truth is that Mr. Ionescu’s words carry weight around the world. How else would we have had so many tens of thousands of people fill the streets around the world? Do you understand that we are tired of the broken record pat answers your government is giving in robotic fashion and that we know your government has no intention of listening to anuone, not even to the norwegian professionals who warned the government that changes should be instituted in CPS.
So what you are seeing is not ‘war tongues’, it’s a sleeping giant waking and understanding that we need to keep the pressure on Norway because if we don’t, these children will never come home to their parents. We will not go away. As soldiers of western countries are trained to not leave the wounded on the battlefield, so too, we will not walk away from the kids and the families who have been victimized by your government and I believe a lot of Norwegians will rise up and demand the same changes we are asking for. We will not go away.
God is patient, but when He decides enough is enough and enough screams and cries have been directed toward heaven by all of the children stolen from their family’s bosom, your system will crumble. And we hope this will be soon!
May God help you to see that you are supporting a system that dishes out utter devastation and I pray that He turns you around to use your zeal in fighting for a REAL just cause. God bless you and reveal His love to you!
Of cause you can make Mr. Ionescu as big as you like in your and the activist movements light, but to me he is just a spokesman for the Bodnariu supportergroup – for the common Norwegian: a totally unknown; if you had asked a thousand Norwegians who he is I’m quite sure you wouldn’t find anyone. I’m not sure the Norwegian government will find any need or interest in this man – and why should they?
You can keep as much pressure on Norway as you like – that’s your freedom and choice. We can live with that, but tell my – why ain’t the Bodnariu organization doing something that really help the family?
what do you mean by your last question?
Rodi, he means something like he has suggested before: that they should talk ever so confidentially to the Norwegian mainstream media’s people, showing them all the documents, trusting them to bring the case out to the Norwegian public. He repeats that none of the Norwegian public has anything to do with the court cases, and from time to time repeats that the Bodnariu family are violent criminals, nevertheless he advises that the Norwegian press would change the case around. (You may have seen a bit of what I have seen over 20 years, Rodi, about our mainstream media? Heard about some of all the Barnevern victims who have put their hopes in the press and seen it come to nothing?) You see, Rodi, the way Mr Nygaard dishes it out and many other similar ways are the ways Barnevern people are used to talking to opponents, and since so many are in their power because Barnevernet holds their children hostage, and since so few achieve any publicity about it, Barnevernet usually gets away with this kind of talk, as if it has some sense. When Mr Nygaard does not quite achieve the same here, he just repeats. The way one lectures a child. And in this case of admonishing Mr Ionescu from afar, giving bad advice.
Good points Marianne! Yes, we have watched how the media stayed silent for weeks and we still have not figured out whose request censored many of our bloggers posts on Facebook and got us blocked from posting many weekends in a row, until Facebook finally realized they were maliciously trying to suppress our freedom to report what the media was not reporting in the first weeks after the Bodnariu children were taken. Even now we have norwegians following our blog and google translating our articles from Romanian and staying informed because they no longer trust Norway’s mainstream media which works more like a mouthpiece for the government. And how many thousands of Norwegians are following DIT as well? I, like others, believe that Norway is the next sleeping giant and there will be a revolution, not by force, but by accountability in Norway as they continue to see the wrongs perpetrated against families. You and so many others have already shown us this and when the norwegians will endure it no more, they will hold the government accountable.. I pray for that day to come soon!
This last comment to Rodi illustrates how important it is for Mrs. M and her chronic comrades that her/their version of .. about everything .. in Norway .. is in the way she tell you it is.
The chronics fear that the energy the Bodnariu case give the handful of activists in Norway will go down to zero if the children end up reunited with the children. The best thing for her movement is if that do not happen and the aggression/energy coming forth give her something to do still some months.
Of cause the Bodnariu parents could be helped to the best journalists in Norway. The last media case got a better ending after TV2 showed the Norwegians what was about to happen in the municipal Stange. This was about a month ago. Have I been a part of the organization I would have adviced the parents to get a “yes” from their lawyers to talk with Lene Skogstrøm in Aftenposten and TV2. The duty silence in Norway give media silence – no common Norwegian know that this family in Naustdal is the Bodnariu family – neither how the look. Here the media know how to give the story so the people involved in Naustdal understand very well who we are talking about and the Norwegians is given the story behind the actions of the Naustdal CPS and the local police.
Some newspapers that show you demonstrating call you lunatics and the commentary fields show that many Norwegians find this spanking enough to act in the way the CPS in Naustdal seems to go – all the way – one child home and the other four in further care. From the information given I don’t agree – I think they all should have been home before 2016 and I’m not sure they would have been moved for a minute if done from my office in Bergen – that if the violence told is the violence done – and violence it has been.
just to show how flaed your system is, why were the children not removed when there was physical evidence of violence on the Bodnariu boys and the Nan children? Why is CPS leading people by the nose, calling it violence, with no proof, against the Bodnariu and Nan parents and calling it accidents when the children were badly bruised and scratched in the foster parents’ home with no further investigation? And how about the faact that in both cases for the Bodnariu and Nan families, the foster parents refused to keep the children together because they couldn’t handle them. In the Nan case, we are talking about 2 kids! What kind of fit parents are those, Mr. Nygaard? It just proves the fact that removal of children into your system is all that Barnevernet cares about, after that, any and all concerns are forbidden. I don’t mean to prolong this conversation, but sir, when you blindly defend everything about your organization it is just plain dumb because you have already lost credibility. You have it within your power to institute reform. I am sure you are well thought of in your organization for valiantly defending Barnevernet in the eyes of the rest of the world. You could put that to real good use and institute reforms and train leaders across Norway so this doesn’t happen again. But again, without making this wrong right, reforms will never happen. Norway will wind up like Australia, making public apologies to an entire generation of stolen kids for the way in which the government mistreated them. Dear God, let that not be!
Australia did the same thing Norway is doing and here’s how it turned out – https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stolen_Generations
You are right Rodi. I can not understand, why they had to split the Nan children. They were only 2! So the last ties are broken now. With Bodnariu, they have placed the girls to a family that has another 3 foster children. It seems that BV wants to create a new identity for the children, but that is where they are completely wrong. You can not erase a child’s history just like that. It can never work. Children are not packages that are moved in between the foster homes just like that.
They BV will collapse, there is too much evidence against them and the parents are not going to be silent anymore. Next to it, other Norwegians are doubting whether “the best interest of the children” is followed. When the people will start to doubt the system and will start critical questions, that will help a lot. Has anyone seen these debates with Gro Hildestad Thune and Marius Reikeras? How did it go?
“The chronics fear that the energy the Bodnariu case give the handful of activists in Norway will go down to zero if the children end up reunited with the children. The best thing for her movement is if that do not happen and the aggression/energy coming forth give her something to do still some months.”
This is ridiculous, Knut. We all agree that the Bodnariu children should be released NOW! After that, we will continue to protest and another willing family will become the the focus of the movement to help the citizens of your country, and citizens of countries using similar practices, to obtain due process.
It is certainly a waste of time for Mr Ionescu to talk to the County Governor in Sogn og Fjordane. Better talk with some more Barnevern victims if he needs more info. All he would get from the County Governor’s people would be what the Romanian delegation that was there got: a long lecture about which way the CPS system is built up, as if they were children – or Norwegian students. That is what anyone gets from Minister Horne and her next-in-command also, including what Horne said 2 dasys ago – again: that children are take from their parents only as a last resort, that they cannot [not true, rather they have decided not to because that’s easy] go into individual cases, that the parents can appeal judgments, etc etc.
It actually surprises me that Mr Nygaard can even suggest it. But then, he suggests many other things too, like all Bodnariu supportert to go to Naustdal to gang up on the authorities there (they would certainly be met by police) or to Bergen to gang up on the County Committee (ditto). The reader should know that Mr Nygaard’s various suggestions seem somewhat disingenuous, because they are exactly the kind of things Barnevernet’s people often accuse families and their supporters of doing “which prove that they do not understand children’s needs”.
So these friendly encouragements are quite amusing to see.
Yeah – and that’s about it – a long lecture is needed for Mrs. M, Mr. Prunean and especially the leader for”the attacking force” – Mr. Ionescu. What can more CPS victims help the Chicago pastor with? How can talking to them help the Bodnariu family. Of cause talking to the County Governor has some impact – you are in person in this headquarter and show that you will fight for this particular family.
Yes,all the readers of this blog understand that now, Mrs. M – that to take the children away is the way a case might end up done from concern to investigation to help measures to end up in the County Board is different than the emergency that happens when children tell or confirm violence, abuse and severe neglect.
I have never been to Naustdal, but now in the spring/summer I think no one can prevent a bus load of demonstraters of gathering outside in front of town hall – and they should of cause have received permission beforehand. No one inside this city hall have considerations with reference to what is said and done around the world – and in Oslo for that part. I don’t listen to it and sure they don’t. It’s your misguiding told as the fact about Noeway, Norwegians and the CPS – and that’s – boring and untrue – for the most part.
Mr. Knut ,you can not call Mr. Ionescu names, this shows so much of you character and if you don’t think by now that God has a part In this you are mistaken. God has heard the cries of all the kids that barnevernet made orphans , and your attitude and also those in high position proves more that you believe nobody can do nothing against barnevernet.. GOD who gave life to all those children can .
And now the children of America are beginning to pray for the children of Norway, mariana. They have told me so.
I have mentioned this before but it needs to be repeated.
The reason that Knut responds with lies and insults is that he has no answers.
I am Cristian Ionescu, mr Knut!
Didn’t see your comments until now!
I guess you would not be commenting anymore, would you?!
And, “big mouth” worked, didn’t it?
Immediately I might say!
Well, as everybody knows by now, I did not boast about it, because we should be grateful to God, it’s His victory, but seeing your arrogance and lack of compassion toward a very tragic situation, I couldn’t help it!
I hope you still have a heart to feel a little joy for Marius and Ruth and the kids, a little humility to admit you were wrong, and some sincerity to recognize that the strategy worked!
Other than that, may God bless you and enlighten you!
Seeing this l’m coming to conclusion that the regime in North Korea is more human than demokracy in Norway – one of the richest country (by money) and one of the poorest (by humanity) in the world. What kind of monstruos system could be the system that is killing people by taking their children from them for no reason!
It is inhumane to deprive children and parents of each other with no goal of reunification. The shame of Norway. In the US, the CPS states that its goal is always reunification of the family.
We – who are not shortminded – and have followed this and other activist blogs in 2016 know that reunifications are done in a lot of cases. This is not black and white – this is legal cases and as you know from your own backyards – cases have winners and losers – and yes – we in the CPS can live with losing a case – that is just clarification of the legal situation and that’s quite ok – we have done our job and if the future shows the legal conclusion was wrong – then we are not to blame. I understand that losing a case is hard for most parents – especially if it’s not understandable. Reunification is possible in some cases.
“…we in the CPS can live with losing a case.”
What kind of caseworker are you? (Rhetorical question)
“…we in the CPS can live with losing a case.” I doubt this very much. It seems more, that CPS hates to loose a case.
In this case even the court has stated, that CPS has rather defended their original decision and tried to find another faults with the parents, then to take another look at the case.
I do not think its unusual. It confirms the stories of many parents, like the Czech-Norwegian couple who had their child removed by CPS and later returned by the court. The CPS has never tried to help them, but instead came with new accusations why the baby should not be returned. Maybe there are some that try to help, I hope so, but my confidence is weak.
The case from Andebu in Vestfold which Pavla refers to, has interesting point. Here is something the Barnevern leader Ingunn Grudesays (my translation):
“Som svar på tingrettens vurdering sier Grude at det er en fremstilling de overhodet ikke kjenner seg igjen i. – Vi jobber ikke på den måten, sier hun.”
(As an answer to the district court’s assessment, Grude says that that is an account they do not at all recognise themselves in. – We do not work in that way, she says.)
This denial is to the court’s statement that Barnevernet has tried to find new “faults” with the parents.
It should be held up against the accounts given again and again by families hit by Barneverne and their friends – accounts so uniform that they certainly indicate that Barnevernet’s people have been taught to do this as a technique: The family says of assessments of them by Barnevernet, of Barnevernet’s reports from meetings with the family, family friends who have been consulted as witnesses say the same –
“We do not recognise ourselves in this account.”
Cf no (43) here: http://www.mhskanland.net/page10/page122/page122.html :
“You must write quite differently if we are to win through getting the child transferred to public care.”
I remember several years ago reading an analysis of cases written by an anthropologist. They were cases with health issues which also involved Barnevernet and other professions making the same kind of judgments as Barnevernet. One item stood out: The families did not recognise themselves in what was written about them. The report writer concluded that the families and the professionals “snakket forbi hverandre” (talked at cross-purposes, misunderstood each other – literally ‘talked past each other’). I spoke with him and asked him if he had considered whether perhaps it was rather a case of one party lying, not the families but the professionals, because of an underlying training about “child protection” having been made part of their profession. No answer.
Such training is regular in all health professions, school professions from kindergarten to secondary school, all law professions. They are taught to be critical of parents, to see like fancy detectives something quite different from what is evident,m taught that the family’s account is never trustworthy and that a family-condemning account is unbiased, objective, professional and therefore unassailable.
One thing seems absent from this view of life: “Objectivity” means truthfulness, it does not mean lack of concern. Outsiders are not necessarily objective, the close ones who love their child are not necessarily “subjective”, lying, faulty in their judgment.
Reblogged this on ANA TATAR ANDRAS.
Anonym blogg om helvetet rundt barnevernstjenesten:
The fact that this blog is anonymous illustrates the fact that families in Norway
live under the terror of sinister Barnevernet.
What is happening in Norway is horrible, but it happens in the USA too! In Chicago, DSS has taken a boy , now a man, named Isaiah Rider has been held for years, away fro his mother. While in foster care, when he wasn’t hospitalized for a rare disease, he was raped, and beaten up. Look up video of this young man, who would like to be free from Chicago to go home to Missouri. There has never been a goal of reunification of Isaiah and his family, EVEN past the age of 18!!!!! This is happening in the USA daily. The movement of taking children away from good parents, for no reason is becoming a worldwide problem and yet we see the abused children being given back to their parents. It makes NO SENSE!
exactly same happens in a UK! ON A MASSIVE SCALE
Yes, it does. A single press senior, Christopher Booker, has written energetically about it. I guess I was too hard on him in 2012, but you can just skip what I wrote and you will find a long list of his informative articles here:
https://youtu.be/zs9PckuNRJc please watch how my child and me are suffering.. please will have to commence hunger strike if situation not change
Heartbreaking story, Eugene. We have been tackling such stories, especially the Bondariu case here on DIT for the past 6 months. There are other cases in the UK that are starting to be publicized in social media and it is becoming apparent that the UK CPS is as bad as Barnevernet in Norway. I hope you find some support here on DIT, and I hope you will receive your son back soon.
thank you for your comment
Your pseudonym is the name of a best friend that I grew up with. As I have never had a child taken, I cannot understand your despair. However, I ask you to rethink this hunger strike. The type of people you are dealing with would be happy for you to starve in the street. The hunger strike will serve no good purpose. Yes, it might create some media attention. So far, I haven’t seen one instance where the media has made any kind of difference in any case. I hope I am wrong. A local media source believes it made difference in a similar case in my county. It was, however, due process that made reunification possible. Our hope is that the right kind of pressure can be put on those responsible for behavior like that of the ones who have taken your son to see that changes are made. We need you in this fight. If you are sick because you have treated yourself poorly, you cannot be in the fight for the long term. You are a talented man. Please use those talents to communicate the problems we face. The Romanians have been the key players in this battle. It is because of an American Romanian, the man who started this blog, that I became aware of this story and am doing what I can to help educate the American public. Only today, I told the story of the Bodnariu family to 10 year old children. They were shocked to hear that such a thing can be taking place anywhere in this world. Several of them told me that they would be willing to join me in the next protest that I organize.
The next time I talk to any group, and I have already made several speeches, I will mention your story along with the story of the Bodnariu family and the story of the Ken Olsen family. The name of the family in my county, Garland county of Arkansas, US, is the Stanley family. They had 7 children taken from them. A crazy explanation was given for this. Due process is still important where I live and the children are now home. We are only just beginning this fight for due process in the rest of the world and we need every person we can get to help in it.
The mainstream only likes stories like yours because it creates viewers. Your story is probably like all the rest. Unless you were “selected” as a target because of your Jewish heritage, the reason was that someone would profit from this evil deed. We will boycott products coming from countries that are treating children like your son but you must give us time to organize. I have already identified companies in Texas that are in business with companies in Norway. I am only one person, but if enough Americans learn of your story along with the others mentioned here, we can organize a boycott of products in countries where due process is not allowed. This is very easy to do but we need time and help. One person can write a letter to a large Texas company explaining why imported Norwegian products will be targeted. The same can be done of companies working alongside British companies. Imagine that 100 people write these letters and then 1000 and then more. We will use electronic media such as this to get the message out.
I don’t know if you are a spiritual man, Eugene. I must tell you that I think this is, in the end, a spiritual battle. The Bible tells us to be wise as serpents and innocent as doves. I have asked God to help us all to have wisdom along with innocence as we fight this battle. I can promise you one thing today. You and your son will be mentioned before the throne of the Almighty God this night.
Romanians love music. I have learned this recently. You might consider asking Romanian churches if you could play the piano at their church services and ask if you can tell them your story. The Romanian church in Hot Springs was the only church that showed up (besides my wife and I) at the protest in my town. It is mostly because i had little time to organize. Most of America has no idea what is happening in the Nordic countries, in Europe, and even in their own country!
Like Cristian Ionescu, I am not patient with Norway or any other country where due process has been eliminated. I think our next worldwide demonstration will be even more powerful than the last one. I will make sure that someone in our next demonstration has a sign about your son. I know some young Americans who would be proud to hold such a sign.
I admit that things look dark worldwide. However, we must prepare ourselves for battle! Christians are putting on their armor worldwide (Ephesians 6:17). We have the sword of the Spirit (God’s Word) on our side. This is the time to be active in as many ways as we can. In order to do that, we must have physical strength. I am putting your story on my blog. It is not the most popular blog in the world, but it is something that I can do now.
Please stay strong for your son and for those who are like him. I know your battle seems like it has already been like a lifetime. Most of us have only become aware of this problem since your son was taken. How many more can we educate in the near future? I don’t know the answer to this question, but I think that if the response I received from 10 year old young people today is any indication, there is hope.
Ultimately, Jesus is our only hope.
Thank you , just discover your mail, i live in a UK and seems yuor movement does not deal with it. As for hunger strike people who undertake it, never male plans, otherwise everyone would be doing that, i just got fed up.
I am only beginning to talk about similar evils in Sweden, Denmark, Finland, and the U.K.
perhaps I sound out of line, but I am not for a long long long campaigns, therefore hunger strike seems almost imminent, otherwise I would agree for my son staying there. It will be an event in a public place, near Royal Court of Justice, or 10 Downing Street. Last time SW decreased contact with my son because they said he never speaks negative about me and therefore it is not good to oncrease contact. Another accusation was that i try to p[ass him UN Convention ofChildren Rights and also phone call from my dad from israel when i saw my son. I will name and shame scoundrels till arested or starved , whatever.
Eugene, this fight is done on Facebook. Are you there? Are you publicizing your case in social media?
of course, I am very active on Twitter! there were 2 documentary with my participation. Tomorrow or Sarurday will check place for hunger stroike – Oi mean where to overnight problem can be removed. i need all support, not discouragement.
I am on FB, several groups, but so many many many paarents… FB alone does not bring children back
Yes, but FB has been the vehicle that made these atrocities known to the world.
that s right, but it should be followed by nxt move – active demo which done against Norway , not UK And there are 100.000 childRen in care of UK
Yes of course i do publisize my case , there are several documentaries, would love to find any support for my hunger strike which is almost imminent, almost , because all is up to G- D https://youtu.be/zs9PckuNRJc
Email me anytime, Eugene. I will tell your story to those whom I know. If you can write it out in English, that would be the best. I’m not the best editor, but I can edit it for you if you like. I will put your story on my blog. It is a small blog but it could help to get your situation some attention. I will also write a speech to tell others your story if I have an opportunity.
Happy to hear you aren’t going on a hunger strike.
You misunderstood. i AM going on hunger strike, it was delayed due to dsome judicial hopes, but they all vanished, Not going to cry on FB or wherever too ,long
Did you read my comment about a hunger strike. It will hurt instead of help the situation.
please if you follow me on Twitter i am in a breqadh of injunction big time and ready to be imprisoned for my son, if G-D allow that.
You said you had my email. Contact me there.
What did you do to get an injunction?
not to talk to media, not to name SW, not to come near his school because all i done went to congratulate his birthday. Media in injuncted as well. I protested with megaphone as u can see from film
UK just try to shut me. ASll case is a revenge fro my EU complains if u saw film u shoujd notice that. Another way is to go after SW in my place so they will get sick of me and let my son go. A phone call from anyone who would say he represent organisation to get my son back will be helpful pf course
Is this you? It is a story I put on my blog.
what u mean? 2 films are here. i do not need any defeatism here, better look for support, when soldier goes to fight he does not thing about death
best will be to find some supporters in a UK – for the moment I am quite lonely
There are others like you in the U.K. but you sound lonely, indeed.
sorry to be blunt, most of them only capable to cry on FB , absolute brainwashed and tamed
Please stay on one thread, Eugene. Sorry to be blunt back, their children have been taken, too.
I just want to see my son not in month and month time, if child is kidnapped by gangsters , then what parent do? run and get child back that is all what a parent should do, I have no such options, therefore will name and shame scundrels till they returh him
How does a hunger strike help?
I know, but their compliance is mind boggling! perhaps different culture I do not know, there was a hunger strike in a US recently by husband and wife, they got some lawyers in a 2 weeks and got some progress , do not know end of story but it helped, history knows so many examples of hunger strikes ,outcomes all different,otherwise will sit all time near computer doing nothing to help my son waiting till he is 18 get ded up with all
You are not in the U.S. where in most cases due process is still the law. You are against a system as you describe it. Little due process. You must know though, that 7 children were taken in my own county recently for no reason.
Is this you, Eugene?
yes same person
OK, thought so, but thank you that I now know.
Please go back and read what I wrote about doing a hunger strike, Eugene.
what is a problem? history knows many cases of hunger strikes, i am not alone, better to provide some support for me, recently thee was a stroy about a US man who went on hunger strike for the same reason his kids were taken
BTW a Romanian guy will commence hunger strike on the 17 at Strasfurg – ECHR. Children adopted. I will have last contact with Guardian on Monday trying to promote some peace, but differences are irreconcievable – they want him in care I want him home. What is mind boggling, they accuse me in attempt to discuss with my son UNCRC cONVENTION OF THE RIGHT OF THE CHILD whih was ratified by British Governement and is officialy promoted.
I have seen the story and a picture of this Romanian, Eugene. His hunger strike will be counter-productive.
it is always easy to critisize, as if we choosing some different tactic, you do not suggests anything decisive anyway, only critisizing, despite of many examples from history and my determination if nothinf helps next few days.
I have already given you ideas that you have ignored. I would do the same to the Romanian if I had a chance to speak with him.
what do you mean? i did not ignore, sent vidoes and mych grateful to you for placing them What else would you suggest? put my story? it is in films anyway.
I have mentioned to you more than once to use your God given gift to protest, Eugene.
in what way?
We need to have this conversation via email Eugene. I have ideas. My email is firstname.lastname@example.org. or you may leave your email here and I will contact you. This is too personal to be talking about on this blog and not efficient. Please contact me. I have given you my email 3 times and you haven’t contacted me. Let’s do it that way. Thank you.
wait i sent u links !!!
OK..checking email now.
will do now send some chrono
waiting as I see no emails from you
If you died in the street by starvation, it would make the media for a day or two, your body would be removed, and life will continue on as “usual.” The only major difference is that a young boy would be without his father. As long as you are alive, he will have hope, Eugene.
thank you for your compassion, I am spriritual of course and blamed for that. I am blamed that my dad was in ghetto!! come on , I have had enough! not on street, but near 10 Downing Street or Royal court of justice, and all solicitors and SW will hopefully pass me everyday. My main concern that I will be removed or attempt to remove I like attitude of IONESKY very much indeed
Find a way to use your musical talents to fight this! God gave you this gift for a reason.
which country are you based? Yeah perha[s will bring some electric piano on hunger strike. I will try not to mess around too much, Bodnariu family fights for thier children here and now, besides since post, LA insulted y religion by judge calling Passover ” untested, unknown , unpredictable environment” and did not allow us to attend Passover. LA decreased contacts wiht my son on the bassis he never speaks negative about me and it shows he is under my influence.I just want to see my son and that is it.
I live in Arkansas a state in the U.S.A. Bringing your piano on your hunger strike will get you some attention, and your location for the strike sounds like it will also get attention. However, I assure you that 1 month after they remove your body from the street, nothing will have been accomplished except that one precious little boy will have lost his father.
i told them that ready to suffer for my son and ready to be impRisoned it happens in a UK with parents
if u watch 2 films which are in a blogm then u will imagine all picture. All my protests very exclusively peaceful and approved by police
Of course the UK wants you to be quiet and you won’t which is a good thing. But a hunger strike makes no sense. The only one who benefits from it is the media and the worms in your grave.
why so?? there was a hunger strike in US by husband and wife in a simular reasosn and they got some progress, why to discourage someone who is determined?
please remind your e mail. You see, Bodnariu family has overhelming support, I have not much the best what could be done is to support my action when it will be started and support in general
My email is email@example.com. Please email me your entire story.
I have to go, Eugene. Please send me an email. I will see it later. Send it twice.
please remind ur e mail thanks for suppourt
No problem. It is firstname.lastname@example.org.
You can write whatever story you like on facebook – you may even make up a story and no one will react. The f.b. give anyone a chance og give the CPS a knock, but never an out. These are legal cases and as long as the conclusions and the legal fighting is unknown in detail we can impossibly differ the truth from anything else. You on the blogs and the f.b. live in your own “world” – you have little or no impact or influence on any legal case in the CPS anywhere in the world – neither in Norway.
I personally never pretended to have any influence via Facebook- publoc opinion however makes lots of difference – many cases in a UK with a proper legal approach.
Your credibility is not real good here at present, Knut. You are the one living in your own little world. The numbers we have discussed speak for themselves even though your CPS system refuses to acknowledge any wrongdoing.
so u received 2 documentaries? have u seen my blog > someone put it for me do not know how to access it , not always,
I have only seen the documentary that I listed here, Eugene.
I’ve already put this documentary on my blog, Eugene. Where can I find the others? Also, I am still waiting for an email with your story. Do you even have it written out? It needs to be written down with all of the details. I will help you publicize it but you have to send it to me.
thanks a lot, I have some good chronology till January 2014 , will send after that i believe all covered by films. that is what I felt. Other videos are my protest vidoes. Reality is that UK almost never give in to pressure from outside – unless it is on Bodnaroiu level – and even then children are taken by relatives, parents are never exonerated.
Your story needs to get out even if it starts in a small way. Please send it to me at email@example.com.
I understand this. I also understand that a hunger strike is counter productive, Eugene.
not sure if u saw my 2 responses
Saw them just now, thank you, Eugene.
I have only seen the one documentary that I have seen here, Eugene. It has been in my top 10 posts watched on my blog the past two days.
I do not see what can I do except of that action, it is always easy to indulge in FB etc, and hope for the bets , but oit does not help regretfully
I have given you other ideas but you haven’t even acknowledged them, Eugene.
why? you mean to send my story? will do, was doing some paperwork, composing text for protesting placard, appearance inof on your blog will not change things too much. And u know that, I need radical solutions now.
You are right. It probably will not change things too much. But some Christians will see your story and I will ask them to pray for you. It is obvious that you love your son more than words can express. If we pray for you, maybe God will work in a wonderful way.
I’ve seen the story and picture of the Romanian guy going on a hunger strike. He is wasting valuable assets, Eugene. He is only weakening himself so that he will no longer be as strong for his child(ren).
I hear what you say and respect yuor view. Not going to argue though.I could give loads of examples of successful hunger strikes, but unfortunately it is unpredictable avenue. If only I may kindly to ask you to show support to a man who lost his 2 kids for adoption and will never see them again. Even if you do not agree, no need to constantly express disbelief and critisizm. He perhaps will never know it, but when i start , will be not useful to hear critisizm all the time. It will not change determination, but only weaken resources. Google on hunger strike or hunger strike UK etc. Please do not critisize all the time. For me this man is an admirable personality, he is going to stay till the end wish would go to Strasburg, but will have to do it here.
I am only telling the truth as I see it, Eugene. He won’t hear my words but I wish he could as his efforts are wasted. I would feel as if I cheated him of my opinion, for what its worth. I only “speak” in love. One can’t be faulted for that.
which pseudonim? Soifertis???
I thought Eugene was a fake name to protect your son.
to protect my son ??from what??
From the CPS
sorry, he is in a foster care, I do not see him fro month and month, almost not at all I do not know where he is
When was the last time you saw him?
it is me
I know, to tell my story to the world is good, however it has been told by tens of thousands and my interview was seen by prhaps hundreds of thousnads, next day UK took it off air, threatening RT- Russia Today. Next day it appeared again – someone put it in a shortened version. UK does not care much unless it will be like in Bodnariu case – and I have no network as them. Rational approach not always good
You contacted me before and I felt so helpless about your case. But I am so glad to see you here on DiT. The Romanian communities around the world have been so much more awake, so much more thinking and understanding about this, than any other group I have seen over the years. This gives hope. Please do not give up. Please cling to life and hope. There are good people in this world. Good people can change life for everybody.
Pingback: Cristian Ionescu Bombshell to Norway: “God Forbid They Not Return the Kids… We Do not Play Tic Tac Toe With Norway” | ARMONIA MAGAZINE - USA
Reblogged this on Slavomir Almajan's Blog.
Reblogged this on B a r z i l a i – e n – D a n (Un Barzilai izvorât din Dan).
This is besides the subject but it’s worth to be watched. Harry Mihet held a powerful Anti-Bernevernet speech in Sacramento on April 16, 2016.
At the link below Mr. Harry Mihet testifies before congress re DOJ’s persecution of pro-life American:
Thanks for sharing, Octavian.
I would have guessed he was pro-life after hearing the Sacramento speech. Now that I know that he does cases for the Liberty Council, that makes it a certainty. This reinforces that knowledge.
Reblogged this on Dumnezeu e în control.
Pingback: “God Forbid They Not Return the Kids… We Do not Play Tic Tac Toe With Norway” - Bodnariu Family
Well said Mr. Ionescu, and the freethinking people of Norway will back you app all the way. Its a disgrace for Norway, så hitting its tourist industi will hurt. Dont bring your children to Norway.
I told a bunch of kids yesterday that they should not visit Norway and Sweden, rune.
Next time I make a comment like this, I will include the U.K., Denmark, and Finland.
Chris, best of all would be if people wo refrain from visiting, or boycott in other ways, also let somebody, on the internet or personally, know why!
An excellent idea, Marianne.
I think you should not visit your own homeland nor buy their product – leave in a hurry for a better future in North Korea and hope that the coming president Mr. Trump is in a bad mood one day.
Now, I know what you think of Mr. Trump, Knut. And I now know what you think or our countries, making them worse than North Korea.
I don’t think Mr. Trump is that impulsive, though I would have really liked another candidate. He would not nuke N.K. unless they asked for it.
Hi !. I have a message for The Light in Truth and Marianne Skaanland. Does anyone know how I can get their email addresses. It has to be email addresses, that are actually opened and in use. This is my email firstname.lastname@example.org. I appreciate any help to make my message to them, being sent in the right direction.
Dear Arianne, my email is on my website mhskanland.net. There is a menue section in the left column!
I’ll be writing you! Just give me a little bit of time – I am preparing to go do a delicious two little interviews. They will be on video, just you wait, ‘Enry ‘Iggins.
Arianne, check your Facebook inbox for message request
God is determined in His actions so should be the man against sin.
Amen, Luc. Well stated.
Cristian Ionescu went there for Ruth and Marius to pray together.Their prayer in the spirit was united with other 66300 and lifted in haven and God will do his will.I believe is nothing to do with autorities,there is nothing to negotiate,here!
God bless ft. Ionescu ,
We all need to pray for him and support everything he is doing !
He really is a good pastor and care about his sheeps !
I admire him how involve he is from the beginning of this case !
Yes he needs to be in Norway , yes he need to talk with authority this is not a game !! Norway need to know that they can do whatever they want with our kids !Our kids are not for sale !
Our kids are God’s property and we are doing our best to make sure they learn that .Its not easy to confront a government , speek up , staying strong in front of the enemy .But with God all things are POSSIBLE !!
God bless fr, Ionescu !!!
As far as I know – the Bodnariu children ain’t yours. If you mean as Christians I understand the use of words, but a pastor in not any legal part in an ongoing CPS case in a foreign nation – this time – Norway. His position is just like yours and mine – we stand on the outside and hope for the best for the future of this particular family,
No child is for sale in the Western world – I think, but we have criminals that might think in that way – child trafficing is a part of that criminal behavior.
Who in the Norwegian society is the pastor visiting and talking to – or is that also a secret for the common supporter?
The Bodnariu children ain`t Barnevernet or the State`s either! They belong to their parents Ruth and Marius! God gave them to these loving parents! I can`t wait to see the picture of all 7 (the perfect number) under their blooming apple tree very soon!!!!
Great comment! Maybe the comment of the year 🙂
“No child is for sale in the Western world – I think, but we have criminals that might think in that way – child trafficing is a part of that criminal behavior.”
I don’t know what would you are living in, Knut, but we have a task force in my own little city that deals with the few human trafficking problems that we have. My pastor is on the task force.
I have often thought of what is happening under your watch to be very similar to human trafficking, Knut. I guess it depends on one’s definition of “human trafficking” to make such a comparison. In trafficking, a person is owned. How is it any different after a child is taken from its loving parents in Norway? Apparently, the state becomes “owned” by the child.
Got that last sentence backwards…you know what I mean.
Knut if only parents and CPS are the legal parts, why does Norwegian politician get involved in 2 cases already? Is she a legal part there? She sent a concern on a family that she has never met and later she has even called the CPS in the same matter. http://www.dagbladet.no/2016/05/11/nyheter/innenriks/barnevern/44176265/
And here few years ago..how is that even possible?
Amen! With God all things are possible! We will work and pray till all 7 in the Bodnariu family are together again! Pastor Ionescu has been doing and still doing a wonderful job!
Knut, I know according to you Bodnariu children belong to state of Norway but I assure you that this is not the case. I know that in your mind once someone is living in your country your state may behead that person if it wishes and we can’t have any involvement but that’s just in some of the Norwegians’ brainwashed heads.
Here is a message I received from an attorney (Anthony Ianosel, L.C) who has extensive experience with CPS in the U.S.:
In the United States, our judicial system is directly involved in these CPS cases. In addition to the CPS specialized attorneys tending to these cases, the courts encourages the parents to file complaints directly with the Courts against abusive CPS officials. We also have a very fair Federal law, in the U.S. Judicial Code, Title 28 U.S.C., Section 1654, which allows any public Citizen [aggrieved by any official] to file complaints with nearest Federal Court and actually be seen and heard by a federal judge [and even State judge]. Imagine, the magnitude of grief in the hearts of the Bodnarius and their relatives and the 5 little children! I am speechless when I think of such a demoniac-inspired calamity initiated with the acquiescence of Norway government to be visited upon the unsuspecting family of Bodnarius! I hope the time will come soon for the Norway government to give an account to a supreme judicial court [just as the German government did for its complicity in the killing of Jews during WWII].
It’s the child that is in focus, Octavian. The Child Welfare Act tell us this about it’s goal: Section 1-1. The purpose of the Act.
The purpose of this Act is
-to ensure that children and youth who live in conditions that may be detrimental to their health and development receive the necessary assistance and care at the right time,
-to help ensure that children and youth grow up in a secure environment.
Section 3-1. The preventive activities of the child welfare service.
The municipality shall closely monitor the conditions in which children live, and is responsible for creating measures to prevent neglect and behavioral problems.
The child welfare service has particular responsibility for bringing to light neglect and behavioral, social and emotional problems at a sufficiently early stage to avoid lasting problems, and for instituting measures to this end.
Section 4-1. Consideration of the child’s best interests.
When applying the provisions of this chapter, decisive importance shall be attached to finding measures which are in the child’s best interests. This includes attaching importance to giving the child stable and good contact with adults and continuity in the care provided.
The child shall be given the opportunity to participate and steps shall be taken to facilitate interviews with the child. Children who have been taken into care by the child welfare service may be given the opportunity to be accompanied by a person whom the child particularly trusts. The Ministry may make further regulations regarding participation and regarding the duties and function of persons of trust.
Section 4-12 Care orders
A care order may be issued
(a) if there are serious deficiencies in the daily care received by the child, or serious deficiencies in terms of the personal contact and security needed by a child of his or her age and development,
(b) if the parents fail to ensure that a child who is ill, disabled or in special need of assistance receives the treatment and training required,
(c) if the child is mistreated or subjected to other serious abuses at home, or
(d) if it is highly probable that the child’s health or development may be seriously harmed because the parents are unable to take adequate responsibility for the child.
An order may only be made under the first paragraph when necessary due to the child’s current situation. Hence, such an order may not be made if satisfactory conditions can be created for the child by assistance measures under section 4-4 or by measures under section 4-10 or section 4-11.
An order under the first paragraph shall be made by the county social welfare board under the provisions of Chapter 7.
Knut, there is no justification for Norway to confiscate children for parents who become ill. Aren’t there better solutions in the progressive Norway? Even Ceausescu offered some help for people who got ill. As a parent if you become ill in Norway you are risking to loose your children to the state. This is inhumane regardless of how you see it from there.
I have never had a case with the need for use of § 4-12 b, but it’s meant for f.i.situations that might occur when parents don’t provide the care needed for a chronic sick – or mental retardet child – or a child with special needs including treatment and education. I think the Norwegian society function so good that the care for these children is done for the most part is done outside the CPS.
We – common ones – in Norway had not Romania on our radar before the execution of the Ceausescu’s and saw this pictures on our telly – probably was this some of Ruth’s motivation to her travel to Romania.
Knut, you are not reading or not comprehending nothing from what we wrote here so far. Again: the fact that there is poverty in some countries and the state is not acting to protect some kids that need protection DOES NOT GIVE A LICENSE to the Nazi state of Norway to confiscate children for trivial reasons. Is it clear enough for you or you will keep showing me videos from countries in which children are not protected enough? As I said before, the Nazi state of Norway discovered oil under the sea, which is not a result of Norwegians extremely high IQs. Therefore, you seem not to understand that some countries do not have enough money to pay foster parents for all the poor kids that need help. Does it mean that, since it happens in some countries, you can put your foot in our mouth for not objecting when your insane Norwegian state confiscate children from loving parents for trivial reasons? Your logic does not make any sense. The inhuman act of confiscating children from ill parents in Norway cannot be excused by keep showing us pictures or videos from ex-communist countries, which economies were destroyed by communism. What Norway does is still criminal. In a court of law you cannot use an excuse for your criminal acts by saying that there are other things that need to be condemned at other people. We are judging a country that falsely claims to be a model of democracy. In fact Norway is the opposite.
“-to ensure that children and youth who live in conditions that may be detrimental to their health and development receive the necessary assistance and care at the right time,
-to help ensure that children and youth grow up in a secure environment.”
Is it detrimental to a child’s health just because one of your social workers decides that a child doesn’t have the correct eye contact with a parent, Knut? A child is taken from a safe environment with its loving parent for this “judgment?” It is absurd.
Chris: “Is it detrimental to a child’s health just because one of your social workers decides that a child doesn’t have the correct eye contact with a parent, Knut? A child is taken from a safe environment with its loving parent for this “judgment?” It is absurd.”
Yes, it is absurd. This is one of the speculative assumptions of the reigning psycho-babble: attachment theory. This kind of “science” impresses the lawyers and judges, who believe that these “experts” can see “signs” which predict that the child will not attach itself to its mother, and therefore cannot receive the needed care from her, and will therefore have its development “distorted”, and/or the mother will not care properly for the child in the future, because she does not have the “necessary eye contact” with the child, with the same result. These sooth-sayers have nil success, but that is only evident in retrospect and in statistics.
Stavanger Barnevern used eye-contact as one of their crown arguments against the mother Sagarika in the Bhattacharya case, cf http://forum.r-b-v.net/viewtopic.php?f=56&t=7763, particularly p 22. The little daughter “didn’t look at her mother” when the CPS workers created disturbance in the home, she looked at them. Something similar: example (5) here: http://www.mhskanland.net/page10/page122/page122.html
and more “eye contact” here: http://www.mhskanland.net/page62/page286/page286.html,
“The view that eye contact is decisive for the “attachment” of a child is based on the idea that humans are like sheep, goats, cows. In these species it is usual that mother and new-born oppspring look at each other directly after birth. In our days this idea has invaded our birth clinics, midwives and nurses being taught to believe that it is necessary for a human mother and her new-born child to stare at each other in order to lay the foundation for attachment between them.”
The way Barnevernet and their allies keep coming up with this kind of quackery is the reason why I should so very much like more people read something, Chris, about all the nonsense and its origin. Both to be able to stop it in a well-informed way and to be aware that such trends will follow each other from psycho-babble circles, so that one should not be surprised when something new turns up. They have destroyed plenty of lives with repressed memories, Münchhousen’s syndrome by proxy, incest suffered by two thirds of the population. And now it is attachment theory. People need to know, to be prepared, not to look non-plussed and just confused when these preposterous claims turn up.
In Norway there are around 50000 active CPS cases at least – are you sure that your propaganda archive has the overview of how all this cases are conducted? All this commenting from your own archive is oneeyed and misguiding as a teller of the truth about the CPS work going on in Norway,
To Mr Nygaard’s remark about the great variety in Barnevern cases round about: Yes, I am aware – and Mr Nygaard has several times emphasised – that there is no common structure of system, method, verification of facts and results in Barnevernet’s work. If all one can say about one’s work is that everything differs in what one does from one case to the next, that of course means that there is no metod, no expertise, no dependability. That does not mean, though, that there are no misunderstandings and faulty conclusions and action to be recognised through all the unfounded babble.
Marianne, that is some list you have there. Everyone should read it and be educated.
“The daughter does not like fish-balls. This is a clear sign of incest.”
“In Norway there are around 50000 active CPS cases at least – are you sure that your propaganda archive has the overview of how all this cases are conducted? All this commenting from your own archive is oneeyed and misguiding as a teller of the truth about the CPS work going on in Norway,”
Who needs an archive, Knut, when 10% of a country has active CPS cases? This is information from you. I think my numbers are right as there are only 5 million people in your country.
No – your math is wrong – 1% is correct – actually 0,9%.
Mistake on my part, Knut. They had better not let me teach a math class again.
Since we are talking numbers, how many children have been removed from parents thus far in 2016?
Each municipal report their numbers to the national statistics yearly – I don’t think 2015 is ready yet. We report to the County Governeur quarterly – they are the controller and if we don’t follow the deadlines set in the Child Welfare Act we get warnings and if not improvement – a fine. In the link below the fine is set for kr. 100,000 ( around 12000 dollars) for the municipal Vefsn.
Maybe I can get this math problem correct. According to this population report, over 75% of the people in Norway are over 20, Knut. This would mean approximately 1,260,000 people under 20. This would mean that very close to 4% of the population under 20 have active CPS cases ongoing. And I noticed that you used the words “at least.” This is an extremely high amount of cases compared to my country. Figured I’d look for apples to apples to correct my mistake.
“they are the controller and if we don’t follow the deadlines set in the Child Welfare Act we get warnings and if not improvement – a fine.”
Deadlines for what, Knut?
One week; Section 4-2. Notifications to the child welfare service.
The child welfare service shall at the earliest opportunity, and within one week at the latest, examine notifications it receives and assess whether the individual notifications shall be followed up with investigations under section 4-3.
Three months/six if accepted grounds: Section 6-9. Time limits and imposition of fines.
An investigation under section 4-3 shall be carried out as soon as possible and within three months at the latest. In special cases the time limit may be six months.
An investigation is completed when the child welfare service has made a decision to implement measures or it has been decided to drop the case. In those instances where the measure comes under the jurisdiction of the county social welfare board, the investigation is considered to be completed when the child welfare service has submitted an application for measures to the county social welfare board under section 7-11.
If the time limits are exceeded the county governor may impose a fine on the municipality. The same applies if the time limit mentioned in section 4-2 is exceeded. The Ministry may make regulations regarding the implementation of the arrangement and regarding the size of the fine.
BTW, Knut, the extrapolated figures for 2100 will be completely incorrect unless the Muslims take control of Norway. With all of the bad news coming out of that country, no one will move there, many will leave, and many may choose not to have children. Word is getting out about my Norwegian friends there who had their baby taken before it was 2 weeks old.
We won’t be around in 2100 for one reason or another (probably death), but if Jesus hasn’t returned by that time, we should be concerned about the next generation. A generation like today’s, with as many people raised by the state as is happening in Norway will implode from within.
I also notice that your population growth rate has decreased substantially since 2011. I wonder if these CPS problems have anything to do with that?
We all know that your laws are meaningless, Knut. They say one thing and another gets done.
Only a few more correct (I think) statistics, Knut.
In the U.S. in 2015, the CPS “serviced” about 1% of the population. We have a larger percentage of people under 20 who could be “serviced” but as it isn’t substantial, I won’t include this. Of the 1% serviced, less than 1/4th needed intervention. Most of that intervention was not near as severe as what we see in Norway.
So, in the U.S. only 21% of the 1% “serviced” needed intervention and most not nearly as severe as Norway’s.
So, In Norway, 39% of the 4% “serviced” have their children placed outside of the home. Of the 39%, 79% are placed in foster homes and 9% are placed in institutions.
Chris, interesting is also the amount of emergency care orders (without warning). This is according to the statistics, about 70 % of all care orders. This number has doubled since 2008. Another interesting number, that nobody can provide is, how many of the children who are taken into care are eventually returned.
That is very interesting, Pavla.
It appears the most advanced country in the world, the most livable country in the world, cannot give simple statistics when it comes to their own CPS system. I would think the number you are referring to would be a very important number.
Knut, is a court order required before children are removed from the home in Norway?
But Norway is playing Tic Tac Toe:
They are busy at present presenting statistics showing that everybody has such confidence in Barnevernet.
Here is something from Nordlandsforskning (research establishment in Nordland county), referred in Dagbladet:
Among their results is this one:
“Blant foreldre som er blitt fratatt omsorgen for barna, er tilliten noe mindre, men fortsatt betydelig høyere enn i befolkningen for øvrig: 57 prosent av foreldre med barn passert utenfor hjemmet uttykker stor tillit til barnevernet.”
(Among parents deprived of the care for their children, confidence is somewhat lower, but still considerably higher than in the general population: 57 per cent of parents with children placed outside the home express great confidence in Barnevernet.)
Golly. As familien-er-samlet says on Forum RVB (my translation): “One could almost say the report evaluates itself. Since the result sounds like the Barnevern worker’s wildest fantasy, it becomes difficult to read it as anything else. If 57 per cent of parents whose lives have been laid in ruins are satisfied with Barnevernet, then I do not trust a single figure in this document from Nordlandsforskning. – When research begins to resemble election results in countries we would rather not be compared to, we should be on the alert.”
“Confidence boost from Nordlandsforskning”
The first thing to ask is of course how the question was put and who is included. Amont families whose children are placed outside the home, we also find some where the children (usually fairly old) themselves have broken away from the home, budding criminals etc. whom the parents cannot at all manage. If a teenager who does drugs and steals everything of value at home in order to buy them, is placed under restraint instead of living on the street, and happens to strike some realistic social worker (they do exist), no wonder if the parents are relieved and approving.
But the figures are apparently not presented in that way. And Mari Trommald, the boss over all bosses of Barnevernet, is happy that parents are so confident. She considers they have received a “confidence boost” and holds that they have in no way a confidence crisis.
A lawyer, Olav Sylte, has a good comment:
He says (my translation):
“The conclusion supposedly stems from contact with a few families whose children have been taken into care (it is not known whether these are voluntary or forced placements.) – It is unnecessary to be a research worker to understand that this is completely wrong. Why would parents who are allowed to live in “peace” with their children be more disstaisfied with Barnevernet than those whose children have been taken? – I have had comprehensive contact with more than 1000 families in Norway who have been deprived of their children, through the last 16 years. I cannot remember a single one of these have had confidence in those who are behind the removal. Not even those who get their children back, have any confidence in the establishment which they have experience to have damaged and violated them.”
Here is a clear statement from Gro Hillestad Thune, Norway’s former jurist/judge in the European Commission for Human Rights, and one of the leaders for the call of concern signed by 170 professionals last year.
About the plan to have Helsetilsynet (The Health Inspectorate) do the analysis of individual Barnevern cases she says (my translation):
“The human rights expert points out that Helsetilsynet already has and has always had a superordinate responsibility for Barnevernet.
– To examine Barnevernet has been part of their job all the time, and in this way the criticism of Barnevernet is also directed to Helsetilsynet. If Barnevernet is bad, it is because Helsetilsynet as responsible control establishment has not done their job, says Thune, and elaborates:
– That is why we asked for an independent investigation of Barnevernet. Norway defends itself with a blindfold before its eyes. The authorities must take the blindfold away and find out what the problems consist in. This understanding must be obtained from someone who has confidence from everybody, not from an establishment which is part of the system today. The Norwegian people must get to know what the background is to the serious criticism Barnevernet is getting both from national and international quarters.”
What happens in Norway by confiscating children using all kind of insane excuses and falsely claiming that the Nazi state is acting in the best interest of the child, it clearly represents an attack upon the family, as pastor John Urs stated in his speech at the Anti-Barnevernet protest in Atlanta, Georgia:
Mr. John Urs is senior pastor at Hickory Romanian Baptist Church in North Carolina:
You can speak as much as you like, but the information coming out is not the truth about the CPS in Norway – not important for Christians? – telling the truth? – just being a microphone based on a handful of chronic CPS-haters and two handful of oneeyed stories from parents that did not win their legal cases??
Your competition for the worst name on Norway and our democracy can just continue – we begin to get used to the irrational naming and it does not bother us at all.
Knut you are talking non sense.Yes, we do not want to present enything which will not be the truth, but you are not on any of our list where we would adrress to find the truth.you and the sistem you are part of have no credibility at all.If you change your wrong practices and stop kidnaping our children maybe we would consult you in 20 years time. Regarding being defiant in the face of the international pressure I remember Ceausescu on the balcony addressing his last speech to many thousands and he was suposly unaware that his boat was sinking and when people start to shout back to him, he was puzzled, he never heard that before in his entire life.then quickly he was taken like you take a worthless thing and from then was all down the hill.
You are the same,you would be lucky if you are dealing with Mr Ionescu or a hend full of others, but if God is the one to whom you are resisting then you have lost already.I am praying that the fear of God would come upon all those who resist God and we will continue to prepay this way.
Here is the link with Ceausescu’s last speech.
My advise to you or whoever else, would be:
Do the right think and fear God and God will bless you and establish you.
If not, then you are digging yourself the hole in which you will fall.
We love Norway and Norwegian people.One of my best friends here in Australia is Norwegian. But we are not tolerating a totalitarian system.We have outlived the communism in Romania and will outlive the wrong ideology in Norway which has allowed that our children would be legal kidnapped by the State.
We would spread the story and shame Norway everywhere.
You have lied saying that you can live with this shame, and you assumed that we would believe you.
No, we do not believe you.
Your Romenian history are of no interest for the free and democratic daily life in Norway – your heads are not ours and we are grateful for the history of our nation as a whole. As a Christian I have my oppositions and I’m quite aware of where we in the Western world are heading, but we are not Ceausescu’s or in a situation like that. Europe and Norway may face war in the coming years – Turkey is our paid doorkeeper and get a lot of power being that. We also face the possibility of civil war. London is no the first nation in the Western world with a muslim mayor in it’s main city.
“…free and democratic daily life in Norway.”
This statement proves that you are a pawn, Knut. It is very unfortunate.
“…it does not bother us at all.”
That is becoming more obvious with each passing day, Knut.
I have another question, Knut. Let’s say a couple of loving parents become ill in Norway. If they ask for help from your stinky Barnevernet, they would definitely confiscate their children. No question about that. The fact that you are there to help is just a theoretical thing on paper. In most of the cases there is an occasion for you to confiscate children, to increase the volume of activity because that’s the way you were trained by your bosses, which have more benefits of they have more employees, more activity. Therefore, the kids end up with foster parents. Now, since the only “fault” of the parents was that they became ill, there was no chance that these biological parents would have abused there children, right? Nevertheless, once they get into foster homes, there are real chances to be abused by the new parents. Norway cannot find any other better options than stealing children from parents. Shame on you!
No, they would not. Your head is mixed up with brainwashed misguiding information about Norway. We are somewhat just like you in Phonix – in a much smaller context. As I said in the earlier comment: I have never had a case with the need for use of § 4-12 b, but it’s meant for f.i.situations that might occur when parents don’t provide the care needed for a chronic sick – or mental retarded child – or a child with special needs including treatment and education. I think the Norwegian society function so good that the care for these children is done for the most part is done outside the CPS.
The keywords are: parents that don’t provide for…
You are brainwashed to think that our job is to get as many children as possible into the CPS care – why should we do that? Which nation on earth think it’s f.i. good economy to provide for the upbringing of as many as possible of the nations children? Of cause – we – as all other nations consider it as the parents duty to provide for their children and the needs in a family. We have no agenda of confiscating or stealing children to give them to fostercare that costs a lot of money. If all the children in the nation were in no need of the help from the CPS nothing would have been better.
§ 4-12 b have the focus on the child. You alter your thinking to make the parents the sick ones. Yes, chronic severe parental illness may be a problem for the provision of needs for a chronic sick – or mentally retarded – or a child with special needs, but as I said in the other comment – this is handled outside the CPS for the most part – I have never used that b nor do I think our office has done it as far as I know. If used I think it is together with the most used one – the a.
“…but as I said in the other comment – this is handled outside the CPS for the most part.”
Maybe you an the people who handle these cases should switch jobs, Knut.
Knut, the Norwegian government does pump put the same amount of money in Child Welfare System regardless how many cases BV has. Secondly, your bosses income is not the same regardless how many employees they have . Therefore, more activity results in more money. In this way, when BV responds to a call of an ignorant who believes that BV is there to help, if BV just gives help and then leaves the scene no more activity is generated. Your bosses trained you to act unconsciously telling you that at every call there might be a case of abuse and it’s better to remove the kids “to make sure they are safe” .. and you blindly trust them without thinking that your boss has an interest. I don’t blame you, Knut. You are just a product created by the system to be used by the evil system. You are a victim also but you don’t realise that.
Correction: Norwegian government does NOT put the same amount of money in Child Welfare System regardless of volume of activity. BV has more activity, the government gives it more money.
Yes – I think you are right, Octavian – the CPS will exist on the same level and expence regardless of how many cases we have. If we can’t deliver our public service according to the Child Welfare Act a or more crises give more money to the local municipal to pay a wage or two more.
My guess for Bergen is that with our municipal form a collected department for fosterhomes – which will result in a leave of around 10-15 employees of our 50 total – will result in an alteration of the now 8 area offices to 4. As all other concerns there is an eye on the economy.
My guess number two is that our wages are going upwards since the earlier state employees have had higher income than us in the municipal branch. Now they will be eqaulized,
Our bosses to not conduct the investigations started. We work out an investigation plan together with the parents. You can’t make up case histories that don’t exist in reality – if you think in that way you are over in conspiricy thinking. Removal are legal cases where the parents have a lawyer – you can’t make fiction and think the legal system don’t find out. I am sorry to tell you, Octavian, that much of your comment is a product of misguided information and thinking that has nothing to do with Norway, Norwegians and how the CPS works.
“I don’t blame you, Knut. You are just a product created by the system to be used by the evil system. You are a victim also but you don’t realize that.”
I don’t know if this is true or not, Octavian. He could be an evil guy.
It is like talking to a brick wall either way.
“He is in Norway to meet with Norwegian authorities this week, and he gave an interview to the top Romanian newspaper Adevarul.”
I wonder if anyone can tell me what Norwegian authority Mr. Ionescu has met or shall meet?
All I find from my window is that he is lunching with Jan Aage Torp and have met a pentacostal that knew Ruth. Not much to brag about. Who is paying for this lunch trip?
If your shameless authorities would refuse to meet Ionescu that would not be his fault. I assure you that it won’t be an honor for him to meet some cowards from your abusive government which pumps up large amounts of money in a Nazi CPS system. If he went there to meet authorities and they refuse to talk to him it’s because they are evil. Who is Ionescu? He is a person who raised international objections to Norwegian abusive system. These objections are taking very seriously by millions of people across the world. If his objections are not valid, your politicians should not be afraid to have a public debate with him, so millions of people would see that your government is right.
How do you know his movements so well, Knut?
Just did some googling – name CI – norway – last week and got the info,
I googled his name and didn’t find the information you did, Knut. May I have the link please?
It’s only Jan Aage Torp that is in need of some attention –
Ah, you are checking rodi’s blog, Knut. It is a good place to hang out.
Mr Nygaard googles too, about a person he disrespects. Since nothing expressed by Romanians and others on this forum, or around the world in the form of protests, is of any significance to Mr Nygaard, (which fact he rarely omits to tell us,) one might wonder why he spends such a lot of time here. Apart from the pleasure of telling us repeatedly that we are all zeros, of course and that any prayers to God for the children under Barnevernet are misunderstood too.
Knut, I don’t think the salaries of Barnevernet employees have to go up yet the requirements for obtaining this kind of job should be stricter (higher level of education, clean background, people with propensity to stick to the truth even if it contradicts their superiors etc). With no intention to offend you, Knut but I strongly believe that you are a victim, a product of Norwegian odious regime. They made you believe that the system is perfect. A system is not odious only when main stream media says so. The fact that Barnevernet’s broken system destroys thousands of families is enough to proof that Norway is a country that falsely claim to work in the best interest of children. They need kids that they may brainwash as they please and make them believe that the system is perfect. On the other hand, why would you bother to criticize a system that offered you a job and nothing wrong happened to you? Why would you care, Knut, what happens to others as long as it did not happen to you? As long as the system offers just nothing but benefits, go ahead and praise it! This is the logic you Barnevernet mercenary employees use.
never mind, Barnevern WILL understand, they just wait till pressure goes away, despicable child snatchers, that is what they are
Yep, child snatchers is a good term, but we will not go away, we will keep the pressure on as far as we are able.