Prof. Marianne H. Skanland was asked in an interview why is it that the Norwegian government does not accept criticism aimed at Barnevernet? Why won’t they listen to the protests thus far?
An excellent question and a revealing answer:
video source: E. Dyakonov YouTube
Delight in Truth 
In this case, it appears that the Norwegian government is tyrannical in that it won’t listen to the will of the people. Actually, it’s worse than tyrannical because the people as a whole haven’t been given a chance to speak. They will eventually be heard one way or another. How will the government of Norway respond?
April 16th will be an important day. We shall see how they respond.
A “maistro” comment for the “truth” propagadist ot this movement. – yes, it’s quite right and seemingly obvious for everyone that a national CPS is a government based and legal constituted municipal service in the wonderful human and democratic Norway. You can demonstrate and do whatever you like till the end of times, but the development and change of the CPS is an internal affair. No Human Rights organization nor political party share this activist movements bias.
It is expected, another arrogant statement by the poorly trained propagandist.
Facts are facts, Knut. Tens of thousands of people all over the world, perhaps over 100,000 will take to the streets to demonstrate the abuses of BV on April 16th.
The vast majority of them are Christians, evangelical Christians. They pray and fast on behalf of Bodnariu and other families destroyed by BV.. And God listens to prayer, dont you think? You say you are Christian… what does the bible say about the prayer of Saints in Rev 8:4?
“The smoke of the incense, together with the prayers of God’s people, went up before God from the angel’s hand.”
Don’t you have some spiritual fear in you on behalf of BV that thousands of people are praying and fasting for major reform in your CPS?
Yes, Mr. Prunean – facts are facts – but you are no longer a Christian that respect the standard of Truth – you are as you said yourself in a comment – a christian activist and you exactly the same as other activists – you share views and information from whatever source they might come – as Truth – although it’s obvious to many that it is pure propaganda – some are fully false – some are a mix and some are misunderstood information turned into ammunition against the big evil in the world – the CSP in Norway.
Yes, Mr. Prunean – I fear God and I have a good relationship with Him. Through my comments I have shared facts and tried to explain in the best way how the CPS and the child welfare in Norway works. It’s up to you and the readers to choose path and act accordingly. The CPS in Norway have no evil intention of harming anyone – we try to do our service to the best of children and families, but as humans we are not perfect – neither are you or your christian commenters.
Yes, Mr. Prunean – you can misguide and misinform as many as God allows you to do, but as Christians we should each one take the responsibility for our actions even if you personally consider yourself a christian activist. As I have repeated – you can demonstrate to the end of times and hold hands around the globe for that case, but that does not change a thing. I respect sincer prayer for families God lay upon some of your hearts, but the CPS as a service is alone an internal affair.
Jesus does not know you, Mr. Knut Nygaard. You will be surprised. He won’t acknowledge you unless you repent your sins. You are evil to the bone; A pharisee who thinks highly of himself and lowly of his fellow human beings. Why do you take our children from us? It is not in order to protect them because they were well cared for. It is because of your greed and insanity. The CPS is a wanton, sick organisation that employs people with no morals. Many are lesbians, like Mari Trommald in Bufetat. What does she know about love between husband and wife or between mother and child? Nothing. You attack decent families and give the children to greedy people like the Thenardier couple in Les Miserables. Kirkens Bymisjon (the Church’ City Mission) actually run houses for barnevernet where parents and children are allowed to see eachother. It is called Myrsnipa. Those people are responsible have witnessed in court against me several times in order to prevent me from seeing my daugher. I am not even allowed to talk to her on the telephone! What kind of evil is this? Barnevernet is an affront to mankind and so are those who defend it.
Barnevernet and its cohorts doesn’t have any shame of anything related to the truth. Your people said so after they have the freedom to say it without your government having any power over them. It exactly what happened with the people that escape the communist gulag. When they told their stories, mostt people leaving in freedom didn’t believe their stories. There are still people that doesn’t believe that was a holocaust, or that the communists killed more than a million people, so there are people that doesn’t believe what happens in Norway or they don’t understand the evil reason behind. The truth is that Barnevernet is targeting mixt national families, true Christians, and anyone that doesn’t comply with their new order accepting to be brainwashed. This is my conclusion and thank you mr.Knut for helping me understand it.
Knut: In another comment you wrote that we can pray all we want and hinted that it is useless, just like our protests. What kind of Christian says something like that? That prayer is useless?
I’ll give you the parable of the unrighteous judge from Luke 18: Barnevernet is the unrighteous judge, the BV victims are the widow, and God is the righetous judge. BV has no fear of God and no respect of man. But eventually the international shame will cause the government of Norway to step in and put an end to the CPS madness by reforming it.
And your surroundings are perfect and in accordance with the Word? You are indeed a big hypocrite, Mr. Prunean. You know that you must accept that not everyone in a society is as christian as you when waching inside your own backyard, but when you look toward democratic Norway you put on another pair of glasses and watch us a society as we should all be believing in the same God, be filled with the Holy Spirit and live according to the Word.
There is one nation we as Christian should keep our eyes on and that is Israel and the Jews. Much of the same pressure that is on this nation and people is on the true believers.
When prayers are built upon false information, lies and mixed motives they sure have no impact. I think some of the support prayers you give to families God lay upon your heart have meaning, but this one eyed activism is a seduction.
Of cause you know with a look through your window that God is not with big letters anymore either in your society or mine. I read yesterday that the quotation: “In God we trust” is to be removed. There is something else we soon shall be forced to believe in and trust. International – then again – you take upon your other glasses and watch India f.i, as a nation that shall lay pressure on the human conditions and the acts of the CPS in Norway – you are hard to follow in your activst thinking, Mr. Prunean.
No, my country is not perfect and it is definitely not in accordance with the Word.
But this is not the subject of converstation on this site.
The matter at hand is the fact that the Norwegian CPS has done a great evil in confiscating the 5 Bodnariu children.
That is the subject of discussion here.
None of the prayers for Bodnariu are built on false information. None.
Barnevernet has committed falsehood in trying to get Marius and Ruth to sign false statements, trying to get them divorcerd, and using leading questions in interviewing children to get pre-determinted answers.
That is the great tragedy.
Leave the USA and other countries alone for now. They are not the subject of discussion.
Who’s talking? I ask a couple of very nice Christian over fifty years old teachers at OSU
about church in Norway and they told me with pain in their hearts that Christianity in Norway is a joke. So I ask them again they told me: you heard me clearly, Is a joke and I don’t speak lightly. So I will ask you to measure your words in describing Christians. You are a lier without shame Knut. Go and serve your master.
Yeah – I can agree to that – demo for the support of the Bodnariu family – the change of the CPS is on the other hand a complete internal affair.
Knut, I will tell you the same thing I told minister Costea: one cannot separate the Bondariu case from the Barnevernet affair. They are intimately connected.
We protest the abuse against Bodnariu because it is perpetrated by BV. They cannot be separated.
If there was any doubts about the propagandist, this comment should put them to rest.
Thank you cecilie, Aristotel, and Delight for telling it like it is.
I’m referring to the comment before this last propagandist ramble.
I missed a comment. The one that should leave no doubt in anyone’s mind is the comment above where the propagandist states:
“Yes, Mr. Prunean – I fear God and I have a good relationship with Him.”
Then – you end up, Mr. Prunean – as a hypocrite movement instead of an activist for a family that are in need of that support and should have been home long ago if the Costea version is in the close of truth.
Then – you end up, Mr. Prunean – as a tool to be used by chronic CPS.haters who give you and other christians false, untrue and exaggerated information about a service much the same or better than the one you have in your own backyard.
Then, you end up, Mr. Prunean – as an activist who no longer consider truth as a high standard for the information coming out of your mouth or on the internet. Just like the arabs attacking Israel every martyr is just ammunition for the propagnada in the movement – Bodnariu I really hope will be reunited soon – if not – believe me I shall tell the CPS that we all must look into it and possiblily learn something that better our service. You say you have the truth in that case – I don’t know how, but I think you rely on the Costea version which is built upon?? Bodnariu may in that case end up as an example for the need for the CPS to consider and handle emergency actions more nationally likewise. Usually we learn just from the case handling our own office produce. Doing so we don’t learn anything that the neighbout office experience in their handling – and Naustdal and their 27 concerns in 2014 was not on our work shift. Bodnariu could be the case that we as a national CPS all should be given the full insight in – given our responses on – and from there give the emergency handling a more nationally aware and conform status put into words in a circular to all CPS’s coming from the government office of Mrs. Horne.
Knut, it seems, that you are little bit supportive of the Bodnariu, but you still call other stories exaggerated? Why is that? How about Cecilie. She has just written, that she can not even call her own daughters on the phone, she has not seen her in years..Why dont you ask her about her story? To me, this is the most extreme punishment ever for a parent and should be only given for a sever abuse. This is not the case of Cecilie as she was never charged with anything.
Secondly, about the mother that can keep 2 children but not all 4. Furthermore, she can only see her boys 4 times a year but she keep her daughters..you can tell me whatever you want, but there is no reason for such a measure. That is like playing Sophies choice with the children. I can not understand that you dont see it..
Why is Eva M. able to work at school and raise a step daughter but not even see her own children? This makes no sense. Either a parent is a danger for her/his children, or someone is not.. If that is true, then this person should not not be able to raise ANY children or work with them..If someone is not a danger, that that person should be able to raise her own children.
The reason is simply that they are all legal cases where the parents and lawyers are the one and only that are in a possible situation to alter the consequences of a placement. I – as a CPS – can be used as a propagnada tool by this activist movement if I give strong supportive messages without knowing the background history and the documentation in each case.
In that case where the mother got the daughters back and not the boys my guess is that it is considered possible that the mother can give the daily care to the girls, but if the boys also return the possibility is huge that they will ruin all and all children are in care again. The mother can cope with the girls – not with the boys who I guess have behaviour problems.
Pavla – in the Eva M. case she is a mother legal part with link to her own child – if she is a stepmother or something like that she is not a legal part to the child staying in her care. That child has a father and mother – they are the legal parts. If that child f.i. has the father and Eva as stepmother – the father in alone the legal part for that child in that home.
To Mr knut nigaar A wonderful un-human and nazi norway?!?
Knut Nygaard lacks coherence in his thoughts. He does not analyze own ideas. But he just know that gut feeling is the truth. Such people are dangerous for families. There are very many of these in barnevernet. They will always conclude that the others are wrong. Such people should not be allowed to work with people.
Hi Arild.
There is a Bible verse that confirms this. I will put it up after church.
Made it before church. I thought it was in Romans but I wanted to verify it.
“18 For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men who suppress the truth in unrighteousness, 19 because that which is known about God is evident within them; for God made it evident to them.”
Romans 1
“wonderful human and democratic Norway.” You got to be kidding.
Norway’s barnevernet is totalitarian and so is the judiciary that allows barnevernet to continue the crimes against families. The politicians of Norway have given barnevernet power to do as it likes against families. That power should be withdrawn. Because of the secretive nature of barnevernet, many Norwegians are still not aware of what is going on or they are, like Knut Nygaard, financially dependent on barnevernet.
The demonstrations against barnevernet is a blessing from God. He sees every child who is stolen from the parents. He hears the silent cries of the children who are denied the enjoyment of a real family, not the surrogate family given by barnevernet. Paid care is not good enough for children. They need the love of their parents, not the stupid “protection” afforded by the simpleton barnevernet workers.
If Norway wants to become a country which does not respect the human rights, then its image in the world will change. Norwegians will have to do business between themselves…
It is a matter of time before the anti-BV movement will call for MAJOR boycots of Norwegian products. Add that to the rock-bottom oil price and we will see if the govt will then listen to the protest
Most websites on which Norwegian products are promoted allow comments if you have a Facebook or Gmail account. Those are strategic places to leave comments (with links) about what’s happening with children in Norway, since those sites have large visibility. One should not forget to mention that Norway has the worst Child Protective Services in the world, where children are separated from families for trivial reasons. By buying Norwegian products someone would support “legal kidnapping” by Norway’s abusive government.
Great idea, Octavian.
Now, if I could only get my hands on a list of these products, particularly the ones coming to America.
I don’t rely on wiki much. but here’s a good place to start. I recognize a few of these names:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_the_largest_companies_of_Norway
Each of these companies seem to have a website listed. I guess I’ll put a statement together and start at the top as time allows.
I find it interesting that the Norwegian government owns 67% of Statoil asa.
You right Octavian,. There is no shame or remorse for Barnevernet and the cohorts that works for Barnevernet.
We have to clean the house in Romania for all Barnevernet suporter and the ones that are bought out by Barnevernet.
I see that Mr Nygaard writes, again and again, that the organisation of Barnevernet is an internal affair. It is not, however, quite clear whether he means that it is internal to Norway or that it is internal to Barnevernet.
To the first possibility I would say: No, firstly: Norway interferes with families of other nations, therefore it is of concern to these other nations. Secondly, if Norway does not understand that it is indeed everybody’s business when the Norwegian state seriously harms the people in the country (just as it is the business of all of us who want to be decent human beings when North Korea starves its population), then Norway has no business being a member of the UN, Nato, or – even more importantly – of the council of Europe, which has a whole Convention on Human Rights which all the member states have promised to obey.
If Mr Nygaard means that the business of Barnevernet is internal to Barnevernet, then this is an interesting philosophical standpoint: a public service which is not the business of the population it is supposed to serve?
Let alone the question of how it all can possibly be called Christianity – – –
Well stated, Marianne. Very valid points, here.
You remind me of Levi Fragell – believing in the impossible. Mr. Fragell grew up in a pentacostal Christian home and was as a young man an evangelist. He came in afflict and turned away from God and his service. He ended up as one of the founding fathers of The human ethic society and use every possibility he have to tell Norway something negative about Christianithy.
I hear you say you are a Christian – and I leave you with that as a good confession. The comparison has nothing to do with your belief – it is what you both see as the goal for your movements.
Fragell’s favourite song is “Imagine” coming from John Lennon.
Imagine there’s no heaven
It’s easy if you try
No hell below us
Above us only sky
Imagine all the people
Living for today…
Imagine there’s no countries
It isn’t hard to do
Nothing to kill or die for
And no religion too
Imagine all the people
Living life in peace…
I have told Mr. Fragell many times that he in his living days on planet earth, may see more people agree with his confession, but he and his movement will never achieve the goal – get rid of the Christians. You too, Mrs. Skånland – will never get rid of the need for a funcionate CPS in Norway. Now – from the 01th of April we are given more power to force help measures upon families.
http://fontene.no/nyheter/foreldre-skal-tvinges-til-barnevern-6.47.354721.10aba46f45
Of cause I mean – internal to Norway – and you know that much about Norway. No, Norway interfers not with other nations – it interfers with citizens in a likewise way. No one in the international world think in the way you and your movement activists do. The CPS’s are everywhere and try to do the same as us all over the Western civilization.
Mr Nygaard: ” Now – from the 01th of April we are given more power to force help measures upon families.”
Yes, exactly.
https://delightintruth.com/2016/03/31/romanian-minister-costea-under-pressure-to-resign-after-barnevernet-comments/comment-page-1/#comment-69185
*
Mr Nygaard: “No, Norway interfers not with other nations”
Heavens, our self-important politicians, and ex-politicians like (Lutheran religious minister and ex prime minister) Kjell Magne Bondevik, not least all our ministers of foreign affairs, sit in their centres “for peace and human rights” etc, and travel the world and voice their opinion on what just about every other nation should do about everything. Norway sees itself as the great peace-and-development teacher. The teaching consists of telling everyone they should stop fighting and sit down at the negotiating table – as if the conflicts are not real and can be solved by small-talk, with Norway as the great teacher at the table too.
I often have to laugh at them, sometimes I blush but I can’t keep going around with a red face so I guess I go into somewhat cynical irony instead.
I’m in a hurry – and you shall put in the CPS and the Child Welfare Law intstead of Norway. We have our tools and our law – we have on our client lists more and more names that are not ethnic Norwegian, but they are Norwegians though – as Mr. Prunean once in his families history once was not an American.
I think this movement to themselves a favout with not looking into the foreign policy and economic contributions done to the best of humanity done by Norway – and then compare it with their own nations.
Don’t you like Norway and Norwegians, Mrs. Skånland? You are free to move – as everybody else.
Mr Nygaard: “The CPS’s are everywhere and try to do the same as us all over the Western civilization.”
Yes, I guess he is considerably right about this. That’s why a few people have woken up in India, saying “We don’t want that here”. And that’s people like Vaclav Klaus Jr gave that excellent talk at the demonstration in Prague last year, and why a few hundred Czechs this year marched from the Norwegian Embassy in Prague to the building where Norway Grants are handled, calling steadfastly: “Keep your money! Give us our children back!”
They indeed should – in this county in India two children a day disappear. Sold to by sexually abused.
http://www.nrk.no/urix/hver-dag-forsvinner-to-barn-i-denne-indiske-delstaten-1.12880839
Another illustrative “conversation” between an obvious propagandist and someone who refuses to be intimidated to move from her homeland in spite of the enormous problems her country faces,
Aristotel, in a country like Norway in which the general perception is that children do not belong to parents yet the state makes the ultimate decisions for them, it was not very difficult to develop a totalitarian agency like Barnevernet which arbitrary decides the destiny of the children. In Norway it’s very easy to incriminate parents for a light spank and some Norwegians would repeat indefinitely that “spanking is illegal in Norway”. However, once the child crosses the line to CPS’ territory, the tone about abuse becomes softer. While parents are banned from spanking their children in Norway as a measure of discipline, CPS workers have a risk close to zero if the children are really abused under their custody.
It all starts with the attitude of a country towards these concepts: “children belonging to parents versus children belonging to the state”. Here is an interesting debate on this topic:
And the Norway part in that debate in your own backyard was?? Yeah – living in the Western world have it’s challenges. I call this movement an assembly of hypocrates.
Octavian, this is an excellent example of the discussion going on in the U.S. about who is responsible for children. We are nowhere close to Norway’s system, but there are people here who would have us be just like Norway or worse. This is another reason for us to take to the streets here in America. Thank you my friend.
The video: Those three women debating would really find a whole shipload of facts to back the reservations against having children the property of the whole community or the state, just not to the parents – just by looking at the fate of the majority of children taken over by the CPS systems of Sweden and Norway.
Hi Octavian,
Wow you said that so clearly that even a moron can understand it.I wonder if Knut will understand anything you said or the hate from inside won’t work up to his brain and eyes. Thank you , Octavian.
Yes, the concept was aired before by Hillary Clinton too. Do you see who’s pushing the conce? I wonder if in the middle are not some dirty Norwegian money. They look for international acceptance.
daughter, sorry not daughters (Cecilie)
Reblogged this on Dumnezeu e în control.
One of the CPS(Barnevernet) measures is how many children their abel to take in to public custody(former Auditor General Jørgen Kosmo). Norwegian public sector do practise New Public Management where production figures and ratios is used just as in the private sector. Children in Norway are nothing else then means of production som that the CPS kan reach their goals about taking in to public custody as many children as posible. So yes, the Norewgian CPS, barnevernet do practise nazi metods to reach their goals and is one of the most corrupt government agencies in the country.
Even this movements activist don’t believe in this nonsense, Mr. Johansen. The work of the CPS is unpredictable – done seperate in our 422 municipalities and of cause someone must calculate something in numbers to have the money needed through our state budget.
We are proving that the Child Welfare system in Norway is bad, not that it is the only bad system in the world. What kind of argumentation is that, Knut, when someone proofs your system is wrong, instead of admiting it and fighting for chance, your response is that “other countries have the same system”? On the other hand you were very rude with Mrs Skanland when you stated that if she does not like Norway she is free to leave. What does “freedom of speech” mean to you? Being free to say only positive things about the ideological system of the country you live in? Do you imagine how abusive may a political and ideological system become if your mentality would be the majority’s way of thinking? “If someone does not like something in our country he/she is free to move to another country”. Is it democracy? Did someone say here that Norway is one of the few countries that considers itself the most democratic country in the world? Ceausescu didn’t take advice from anybody except from his party and we called him a “dictator”. Your government do the same and you call it “democracy”. Communists look down to everybody. It’s a complex of superiority…
I have thought the same, Octavian. Words have different meanings in the 21st century. In this case, dictatorship and democracy are more similar than they should be.
You get it all wrong – and now I don’t know which Octavian I am commenting to – it’s seems to have gone inflation in them – yesterday three individuals with the same same and two Aristoles.
You have an election for president coming. Some like Trump – others use a killing-language. Do you consider your election is done in a democratic way? We do it of cause by election ourselves – every fourth year, but we have more parties and the winner must take other parties in to make a plural. The parties ruling now are Høyre – Right and Fremskrittspartiet – The Progress Party – these two parties are the less socialistic parties in Norway. The Progress Party is hated by the socialists because it’s restrictic to free arrival of travellers. These two parties have help from two small parties – Kristelig folkeparti – The Christian peoples party – and Venstre – Left -.but not the socialist left. These two small parties give the two ruling parties a plural in the votings if agreed.
I understand Mrs. Skånland – by reading her comments – to disagree with all political parties and in that way she reminds me of the attitude of an anarchist. She is agains everything in control and as I read her – not just the CPS, but all our positions in society that links to the work done by the CPS. She has said that she has an unrealistic dream of a coming revolution – if her hope is to get you to take her to that position I don’t know, but I think she is realistic – it’s just talk.
We have the same system according to free speech as you have and of cause you can express criticism to whatever you like without consequences. We – in the CPS – on the other hand have duty silence and can’t talk in detail with anyone about the content of one day at our work – if done it will sure will give consequences.
I’m surprised the propagandist can still write. He is well into the magma.
Hi Octavian,
Wow you said that so clearly that even a moron can understand it.I wonder if Knut will understand anything you said or the hate from inside won’t work up to his brain and eyes. Thank you , Octavian.
Knut Nygaard: “The work of the CPS is unpredictable”
If you only see one odd Barnevern case, you probably jump at this, crying “Yeah, I’d say it is!”
But I would say “It is and it isn’t”.
From the point of view of what Barnevernet officially CLAIMS to be, what they ACTUALLY do is unpredictable. It does not create welfare or assistance for children and their families. So it is mostly unexpected, e.g. for families who ask Barnevernet for help with specific tasks.
A rather blatant example among many, is the statement of a very senior inspirator of Norwegian CPS (she has been translated into other languages too), Kari Killén, about families struggling with e.g. economic problems. I have touched on it here:
http://www.mhskanland.net/page10/page116/page116.html
“Many of the people who themselves approach the CPS asking for help, are in a difficult financial situation. But CPS workers are instructed fairly clearly not to assist them with economic relief (p 497):
“Parents should be made to get involved regarding the reduction
of outer strains, e.g economic problems and housing problems.
To solve the problems is bad care [bad social work].”
The book then goes on to say that the CPS should “direct” or “guide” the client towards problem-solving. This is unrealistic social work to say the least.”
Killén is the same one who says that it is important for the social worker deliberately to put strains and frustrations on parents in order to “test” them. (Comments in the same article.)
But from the point of view of those who have seen a number of Barnevern cases, what Barnevernet does when it focuses on a family is not unpredictable, not unexpected. It is boringly uniform: They pester the family with “assistance” of types nothing to do with whatever the family might need and which is therefore not wanted, until the family is “frustrated”, quite rationally, into trying to get rid of these parasites and get their freedom back. Then Barnevernet takes the children. Or they create situations which make it possible to take the children right away, for example in families that do not need any help but have been reported by some “worried” person with whatever motive. – Barnevernet is allowed by all Norwegian authorities to do this. So it is none of it unpredictable. The only unpredictable thing is that once in a while some court judgment or county committee decision actually finds in the family’s favour. It is then not unpredictable that Barnevernet will appeal the decision and do their best to hinder the (re)unification of the family.
To work with people in general is unpredictable. We meet people unknown to us after receiving a concern given us and accepted by our staff meeting as the right address where the concern give the start of an upredictable investigation process. When we receive a concern that our leader and legal advicer give the green light for emergency we go into an unpredictable day and process – we don’t know whether this is fish or bird. The process and investigations followed will show us.
In Norway – when Killen wrote this book – the CPS was not seperated from the Social office. We worked in the same office in two seperate departments. It was a short distance between the guidance and work done by case handlers in the Social Office and us in the CPS. The departments had a united leader. I could work overtime in the Social Office if that was needed. We went our seperate ways at the end of the 90’s/2000.
This last passage is a good example of how the language professor use Words to produce an outmost negative propaganda effect – “pester” and “parasites” – when what we do togheter with the legal parts involved are to cooperate on the unified interest in how we get facts to the investigation that have a 3 month work plan settled by our law.
If we are on a help measure level our job is in the end of the investigation to “sell” in measueres that we consider can help the child and the family as a whole. If the legal parts don’t won’t any of our measures it is the content of the investigations concerned that give the next step – either to dismiss/shelve the case – as we do in around 50% of our investigations or dismiss/shelve(?)- or to dismiss/shelve the investigation with concern – in that way that it shall undergo a new investigation six months from the concluding without the need of any incoming new concern. In some severe cases the investigation go direct to the County Commitee.
We all know who the real propagandist is here, Marianne. It certainly isn’t you. Also, thanks for the information on unpredictability. The real propagandist is a bit unlike his employer in that he is VERY predictable.
I understand very well that one might not like seeing people carrying out a certain activity, perhaps close colleagues even, described as leeches and the activity as pestering. However, I ought perhaps to have said that these are translations of terms used by families (including children of the family) who have experienced the CPS on their backs. Considering the seriousness of what so many of these families are exposed to and forced to accept, from people who pretend to “work” WITH the families for everybody’s best, I do think it appropriate to show some of the families’ own judgment on these activities. It should perhaps worry CPS workers a tiny bit that many of their “clients” consider this to be the truth.
The families can normally not show their assessment themselves, since that would certainly strengthen the CPS’s judgment of them as “not a functional family”, the result then being obvious. Plain speech from CPS victims can even land them in the criminal court, for “threatening behaviour”. There are a number of such cases, often leading to jail sentences. Again, it should perhaps worry CPS people how many families are so devastated by what the CPS workers do that they burst out in despair in a manner which might be perceived as threatening. It is deep family love that causes it.
A demonstration againts a national CPS is one thing – done to nazi, fascist, communist, Gestapo, Holocaust a.s.o. – and then done to the world’s target no. 1 is not just unfair – it’s not close to truth. I know – we in the CPS know – that receiving a letter from the CPS for the first time is not easy although it’s written that we have got a concern from …. and in it is said that … (short version) and that we want to hear your reaction to this. The purpose is to consider whether you are in a help posistion or not. In the first meeting you get much information about us and the investigation. You tell your story about what’s written in the concern – we need someone to confirm information and we cooperate to find out who that will be – time for next meeting – maybe a homevisit – see or talk with the child done where – and then conclude within the time limit of 3 months.
Yes, we know we are more intruders than guests in some visits. If we just was a service where parents themselves asked for help we would have quite few for the little ones and a massive predominance of early teenagers and upwards. We would have little possibilty to help families at an earlier stage when the problems weren’t that huge and damaging. The common Norwegian is not close to the version of the CPS this movement market.
“Unfair” ?
But you are thinking only of yourselves, of what you THINK you are doing. It is entirely self-centered. You are not interested the actual results for the families you target. When one’s results are as bad as they are in Barnevernet, for both children and parents, and when on top of that lots of the families – INCLUDING the children – say they hate you and fear you throughout, then one should withdraw. Good intentions are not enough. We all know the saying “The pathway to hell is paved with good intentions.”
You find CPS working in quite the same way as we do in every Western country – you find a mini group of chronic CPS-haters in these countries and you sure find some that is not pleased with the way their legal cases have gone. Yes – it’s hypocratic to attack Norway when the same system is in their own backyard – to support families like the Bodnariou’s is another case – they are in need of support – like the Aria parents and others, but you and the movement are no legal parts and can’t change a thing – you can support only.
I live in USA and I raised five children being in contact with hundreds of families because the children participated in sports, music and many other activities and never heard abuses like in your country Norway.done by CPS. Barnevernet abuses are out of ordinary. The philosophy of running the CPS in Norway is wrong, totalitarian style without responsibility. Of course CPS is acting in USA but responsible, and they correct their actions when something is done wrong and if is possible their interest is to keep the children in family. Even the drog using families if they take action and clear themselves out and act responsible they get their children back. CPS in USA doesn’t have total power like in Norway when the worker of CPS is shielded until he comit unheard crimes. Exemple of that kind of hypocrisy are many. CPS of Norway earned without doubt the name of Children Poaching Service.
Mr Nygaard seems somehow to gloat over the CPS’s total powers. Very reminiscent of other dictatorial people, dictators think nothing can ever change from “below”.
Wo why is Mr Nygaard so energetic in trying to get people to stop the demonstrations? Saying again and again that they will have no effect and that they are carried out by a sorry bunch of confused fanatics? – The contradictory psychology of it is not without interest.
But in fact there are times when one does what is right in spite of depressing odds. We demonstrate because it is right.
“Again, it should perhaps worry CPS people how many families are so devastated by what the CPS workers do that they burst out in despair in a manner which might be perceived as threatening. It is deep family love that causes it.”
Please allow me to share a story that I think relates to this subject, Marianne.
A few years ago, I was the canvasing coordinator for a local political campaign that was quite heated. We had found many good spots to place campaign signs and made sure we had the property owner’s permission to put them up. One placing was particularly strategic and we had permission from the property owner to put a large sign there.
We received a call that our opponent’s sign guy had taken down our sign and put a up a large sign promoting our opponent. A friend and I went out to investigate.after making sure we were in the right. We removed the opponents sign, placed it behind the fence (we could have destroyed it) so they could get their sign back, and put up another of our signs.
A white truck pulled up and a fairly well-known personality in town told me that I was committing a federal offense. I must admit, I got a bit loud in my disagreement with him. He didn’t respond and left in a big hurry.
Phone calls were made between campaigns including one from the bully candidate we opposed. The call was made to me and the voice sounding very threatening. I told the bully we were in the right and gave him information where his sign guy could find his sign.
I really didn’t care what the bully thought, but I wanted to make sure I talked to the man who said I was committing a federal offense. Although I got a little loud with him, he seemed like a nice enough guy.
I approached him on his turf, at his work, to iron things out. I wasn’t going to apologize for my response but I wanted to make peace with the guy. After hellos, I told him I was only doing what was right and he still seemed not to agree. I had done my best to make peace and then turned to leave when he said: “And you had that hammer in your hand!”
I couldn’t help but start laughing. “How else were we supposed to remove the illegally placed poster of the candidate you support?” I replied. After he clearly understood that I had no intention of using the hammer on anything except to remove sign wires, his countenance changed. To this day, when we see each other, friendly greetings are shared and there are no hard feelings.
If my children were taken from me like the Bodnariu family, I would have a myriad of emotions. However, like the Christian Bodnarius, I would not take vengeance into my own hands. Jesus teaches us to love our enemies. Do we love our enemies when we don’t tell them when they are wrong? I think not!!! Jesus is our example. We must speak the truth for the benefit of all and in spite of the consequences. It appears that Norway’s CPS will call any action “threatening” in order for self preservation.
As I have stated here before, without God’s truth where can one find true wisdom? Because the majority of church members in Norway say they are not Christians, how can one expect to find Godly wisdom in such a country? This is the root of the problem.
Hi Scott.
What I take you to mean is that the Barnevernet is a business with no morals. I agree with that assessment as do the majority of those on this forum. Does the B.V. use this New Public Management you mention? Do you have a quote from former Auditor General Jorgen Kosmo?
Knut Nygaard, I didn’t see any other Octavian here and I’m glad you click on my name. It’s true and I use 3 different webpages, all of which I have activity on. So if someone finds something to criticize at all Norwegian parties you call her an “anarchist”. In order to be a democrat you must consider at least one party as being perfect, nothing to criticize, correct? You don’t criticize Norwegian CPS due to at least two main reasons: 1) They allow you to say only positive things about them (even if they are not true). 2) You have benefits from them. Isn’t that awesome to have a stable job now when the unemployment continues to rise in Norway?
http://www.thelocal.no/20160330/unemployment-continues-to-rise-in-norway
I don’t know how you find this information, Octavian, but you are like a detective. Great info.
The article states:
“The rising unemployment rate is largely due to a double oil downturn in Norway – the combination of declining investments in the Norwegian continental shelf and a drop in oil prices of about 65 percent since the summer of 2014.”
This is something that many of us have speculated as the world now has a glut of available oil. In economics 101 I learned about supply and demand.
It doesn’t appear that the supply will go away anytime soon as large amounts have recently been discovered. This will only hurt Norway’s economy more. I haven’t researched their national debt but if they aren’t deep in debt like the rest of the world, they may be soon. Funding to organizations like the CPS may need to be cut. Sadly, this effects the average Norwegian as well. Maybe those who belong to the church who claim not to be Christians will begin to think of more important things than those that are temporal.
Wow. You guys need to check out this excellent website that someone in Sacramento, California put up. Rodi shared it with me:
http://returnthechildren.com/
Everyone in Norway is free to criticise – of cause also our language professor, but she has been the provider of a language in the movement that goes behind criticing in a normal manner.
Mrs. Skånland began early in her criticising carrier to use words as you in the foreign countries now use with an impression of that some of the context in these words are the truth both about Norway and of us in the CPS – words that leads us to nazism, fascism, communism and dr. Mengele/Holocaust. To do that about your own country you must hate something very much. I don’t know the personal life of this woman more that she has lost her husband and that she has no children. You are an activist of a certain caliber if you use these kind of words about your own country, people and a public service. Now she has misguided you to believe that our free, democratic and functionate nation is something close to the words she has used for decades.
Yes, she and others are free to criticise, but you don’t need to change us as a nation to something that is not true. If she and the movement think common Norwegian listen to this mocking of our nation – we/they won’t. This woman is a nobody outside this movement of a hundred chronic CPS-haters in Norway.
Yes- as I have said Norway is in change and the changes in the oil price make us as a nation volunerable. As you have found out – unemployment is rising – our children are more on facebook than doing what they should do in school; many quit and are on welfare at the age of 18. Our welfare Level have been generous, but the changes in Europe as a Whole has made us number one destionation for travellers that we don’t know who are or where they are coming from either than the are expencive to our nation. A house in Norway is expencive and many of the young families live in apartments not fit for families. We begin to see a difference between the poor and the rich – again ( like before the oil change).
The world is waking up…
Knut, the solution is to stop confiscating children for trivial reasons. I am sure CPS’ employees would find some jobs. Fabricating false abuse cases should not be considered a job but a crime.
To work with people in general is unpredictable. We meet people unknown to us after receiving a concern given us and accepted by our staff meeting as the right address where the concern give the start of an upredictable investigation process. When we receive a concern that our leader and legal advicer give the green light for emergency we go into an unpredictable day and process – we don’t know whether this is fish or bird. The process and investigations followed will show us.
Imagine if police or doctors did their investigations in such an intrusive manner Knut Nygaard, just bashed your door in maybe hold your family captive but really not knowing if it is a fish or a bird…
Imagine the doctors just cut you open, not knowing if it is a fish or a bird…
What makes the barnevernet capable of such bad manners, such intrusive actions without prior investigation? What does it mean? that you are better than the other’s or more unproffesional without empathy and manners… Or is it simply that you dont really care about the fact, since it is only children and children are needed for the barnevernets sustainability? Please dont come with a bad answer, i have seen that you are truly capable of reflections in your answers…
Imagine if police or doctors did their investigations in such an intrusive manner Knut Nygaard, just bashed your door in maybe hold your family captive but really not knowing if it is a fish or a bird…
Imagine the doctors just cut you open, not knowing if it is a fish or a bird…
What makes the barnevernet capable of such bad manners, such intrusive actions without prior investigation? What does it mean? that you are better than the other’s or more unproffesional without empathy and manners… Or is it simply that you dont really care about the fact, since it is only children and children are needed for the barnevernets sustainability? Please dont come with a bad answer, i have seen that you are truly capable of reflections in your answers…
God bless you Octavian for introducing this blog site to me! For years I have desired to be a part of an engaging dialog with Christians that have a passion to expose and bring righteous change to the CPS system that is too corrupt to fix but needs to be uprooted and rebuilt afresh to be a “Godly Agency” that truly loves children and their families! I suppose a protagonist in the mist here is advantageous for those of us that have God and all of heaven on our side, for to come face to face with an enemy is how God has always used His mighty warriors in bringing down His glorious victories.
For many years I advocated victimized CPS families in Arizona. I know from firsthand experience just how evil the CPS system is. In 1993 I became aware and had a reality check of these atrocities and persecutions by the State and CPS due to my own faith in Jesus Christ. I had my two small children abducted from me and after two years, miraculously by the power of God had my children returned to me. God has turned my tragedy into His triumph! He will do the same for all who cries out to Him!
God loves it when the odds are against His children in the fiery furnaces, for when they have Triumphant Victorious Victories He gets all the glory! I would love to be a part of your group to help bring restoration to this precious family in Norway!
I am a history researcher as to how causes and effects occur in national cultures which is impacted by those in government. I love the biographies of America’s Christian Founding Fathers, therefore their statements and quotes have proved to be trustworthy and truthful through the generations. I believe these quotes will give great food for thought as to WHY Norway, America and many other nations even has a CPS diabolical crisis in their land!
George Washington, First President of the United States: “It is impossible to rightly govern the world without God and the Bible”
Noah Webster, Founding Educator: The principles of all genuine liberty and of wise laws and administrations are to be drawn from the Bible and sustained by its authority. The man, therefore, who weakens or destroys authority of that book, may be ACCESSORY TO ALL the public disorders which society is doomed to suffer.”
Noah Webster: “The Bible must be considered as the great source of all the TRUTH by which men are to be guided in government as well as in all social transactions.”
A nation is as strong as its Family Units! God is God of the families! Family is meant to represent God’s Kingdom on Earth, so of course satan is on the rampage to destroy families! God is rising up His Remnant to bring a paradigm-shift in order to bring back His divine design for America to be His Lighthouse for all nations once again!
Welcome to the discussion, Crystal!
Welcome here, Crystal. You will be shocked to learn about how aggressive and dishonest Barnevernet has been in dealing with the Bodnariu family. We look forward to get your insight on the story.
It was very interesting to read your posting, Crystal. I too have seen cases in the US and read about them. About 15-20 years ago I wrote on several websites with largely American writers, and I was in correspondence with some of the people. (Cf the last three articles here: http://forum.r-b-v.net/viewforum.php?f=56&start=150) And generally: The thinking within CPS units tends to be internationally much the same and it is spread around, certainly in the Western world, simply because the field of social work is quite international, they translate text-books and hold conferences and so on.
Nevertheless, I have to agree with the way several posters here on DiT see things: that Norway is in a particularly bad way just now, partly due to a very large and domineering public sector and strong powers given to the state and accepted by the population. So therefore, an effort to bring things in a different direction here is urgently needed. It is a blessing for the many families here which seek desperately for help against unreasonable CPS actions, that so many in Romanian communities, and other people abroad too, have come to see how destructive the CPS action in the Bodnariu case is, most of all for the children, and are prepared to spend time and effort on making it known that this kind of “protection” of children is not what it pretends to be.
And it might have some positive consequences in other countries too if Norway could be shown up clearly. – What do you think?
Yesterday I was in Tucson AZ court dealing with my own CPS Criminal Court Case. Tucson is a 100 miles away from my home in Phoenix AZ so it took up my whole day. I been in this battle since August 1, 2013.This is God’s designed battle that will end in victory! I will post all the dynamics at a later date when the time is right. I just now read your post to comment on.
I totally agree with you that the CPS social worker mentality is a world-wide crisis. I am over joyed to be a part of God’s movement in this Christian Romanian community that is rallying against this rouge agency and demanding and fighting for the Reconciliation and Restoration for the Bodnariu Family! I have worked for years to get the church community to wake up and speak out and support the thousands families that are being destroyed on a daily bases by CPS!
Years ago there was a prophecy that God was raising up the Romanian people to radically bring God’s restoration to nations! I believe that is exactly what you all are doing here! It is the beginning of this Word from God! Norway will be used as an example to the world that God is saying “Enough is Enough” of His children being destroyed by His enemies that are devastating His families! Yes! The Bodnariu Family is God’s vessels in being a precedence to Nations in how He reconciles and restores His children when His people rise up against this evil by His Holy Spirit through the name of Jesus Christ!
There is a verse that describes this Holy Ministry of God!
II Corinthians 5: 18 And all things are of God, Who has reconciled us to Himself by Jesus Christ, and has given to us the Ministry of Reconciliation.
By faith the future is bright for the Bodnariu Family!
I meant to write, “Yes! Marianne, I totally agree with you….
Knut Nygaard uses the word “we” as he speaks for all Norwegians. The truth is that he only acts on behalf of a small elite class in Norway. Also most Norwegian parents fear the CPS system of the country, and this system, with all its collaborating dervices, has nearly no support among common Norwegians.
I have thought this for some time now, AST.
I think you have concisely expressed the beliefs of most who really know the truth about Norway.
Thanks.
8 og 10 families given help measures are pleased with the service given from the CPS. It is the emergencies that give the parents involved often a negative impression of the involvement. I have met parents that in such cases that understand Our important role in the society and are glad we react despite the circumstances the emergency give them in the moment. We have a job to do to be more collected in our emergency assessments. The common Norwegian have no more fear for the CPS than Chris has in Arizona.
Knut Nygaard is not telling the truth. He refers to a propaganda-research. People who got money or babysitting from barnevernet was generally satisfied. The survey was prior information about the abuses became so well known. Media do not want to disseminate our information. We do not know if those who were included in the survey was anonymous enough. Those who experienced the use of force was excluded from the survey. Anyway, this does not say anything about what most people think. And at least it says nothing about the abuse in barnevernet. Knut Nygaard are familiar with this information from previous debates. He ignores it.