Prof. Marianne H. Skanland Warns About Extensive Government Surveillance in Norway

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Total surveillance of Norwegian homes to prevent crime?

March 11th 2016 brought the news that our government intends to increase secret surveillance in Norway. The Minister of Justice will have the police carry out new types of surveillance, without having to obtain a court order beforehand, including secret searches of homes, placing of secret microphones and cameras, hacking into private computers to obtain mail correspondence but also to monitor running activities such as drafts of mails which are never sent. (Links here, here and here).

The motivation behind this is to prevent terrorism. But the proposals will cover all “serious crime”.

The effect on family life with children

Having paid some attention to the public debate about children in Norway over the last twenty years, I have seen groups of people, such as politicians and lawyers / jurists concerned with ‘child rights’, develop a way of thinking of nearly anything negative in children’s lives as very serious offences against them.

It is as if they truly believe that children should grow up in padded cells and never get acquainted with sorrow as well as joy, setbacks as well as success, uncertainty and danger being part of life that one needs some experience of.

The Minister of Justice proposes here:

“Typer saker dette skal gjelde for er blant annet kriminalitet som drap, terror, menneskesmugling, frihetsberøvelse, overgrep mot barn og masseødeleggelsesvåpen, hovedsakelig med med strafferamme over ti år i fengsel.”

(Types of cases where this will be applied are e.g. crimes such as killing, terror, human trafficking, deprivation of liberty, abuse of children, and mass destruction weapons, mainly carrying a sentence of 10 years or more or imprisonment.)

10 years may sound reassuring, but we are on a slippery slope, very likely. This is seen from the debate: Serious politicians mention the possession of child pornography as a reasonable target for such surveillance Dagsnytt 18 (the daily news at 6 pm). This topic starts at 00:56

Children are clearly in people’s minds and no doubt anything called ‘violence’ against children is covered by ‘abuse’.

What will happen?

So I think it very likely that such surveillance as they now plan will be snapped up as a possibility by the child expert professions, and carried out in any home with children if Barnevernet (the CPS) sees fit to do so, nobody in Norwegian public life protesting very much.

There are already CPS cases in which the CPS has planted people in the home to sit there and write down whatever the family members do (or their ‘interpretation’ of it). In addition to driving the family out of their minds, it is of course used by the CPS as proof that the family is an unfit place for children.

There is already a mental climate in Norway that does not greatly object to total nanny-state monitoring of everything. An example is that psychology expert Einar C. Salvesen, who holds the abduction of the children to be a tragedy and wants to help them, had no reservations to suggesting an alternative method which he thinks the CPS might have done well to use: put a CPS worker or a psychologist in the Bodnariu home, to be there 24/7, to observe what they did and advise them on their treatment of the children. He also recommends that not one psychologist but a whole team of psychologists should evaluate any single CPS case. But actually, that is what they do already, just in a slightly different way: They often evaluate other psychologists who have been engaged in the case at an earlier stage. It is very rare that this helps the family, and it has certainly not led to any revolt among psychologists against the way most of them conduct their work in CPS cases.

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Marianne Skanland is a Professor Emeritus of linguistics at University of Bergen, and has spent many years researching and criticizing the Norwegian CPS.

Marianne’s website is http://www.mhskanland.net/index.html

62 comments on “Prof. Marianne H. Skanland Warns About Extensive Government Surveillance in Norway

  1. I hope this isn’t surprising. This is what happens when people allow the gov’t to run their lives. Society today has been reduced to mindless peons and it will get to the point where even protests will be unthinkable.

    The family I mentioned in an earlier comment had their email broken into and emails stolen. When this was brought to the attention of the courts, they just shrugged and carried on.

    And that was Canada…

  2. This shouldn’t be a surprise for anyone the Internet open your life to be known by government and law enforcement without any approval. They have the technology to turn on your computer and get all the info out, and look at you through your phone or pc camera. Big brother really like to give you the opportunity to talk and record your actions so he can know everything about you. So be careful.

  3. So anything I write on my computer can be read by Barnevernet and used as evidence against me in a court? Sounds pretty scary. Already children protection workers are reading my facebook statuses, googling my name and of course reading my “private” correspondance to my daughter. I guess privacy is a thing of the past. Respect of privacy is certainly not granted to neither parents nor children under the guardianship of Barnevernet. They keep telling us they do this to protect the children, but I cannot see how this constant harassment and impudence is protecting children. It is destroying the happiness of children and causing parents great pain and sorrow. The police is the puppits of the Norwegian barnevernet and will apparently go to any length to satisfy the administrative leader of barnevernet when she calls and says she feels “concerned”. Probable cause, forget it, “concern” is the new standard; Welcome, Brave New World.

    • Yes, this is true. People are arrested for wrong picture in your photo collection or video record in your computer. In fact a employer doesn’t need references as a condition for employment or to be accepted in a social group they need your name and your phone number or your email address. You can be set up by a good hacker and get prison time or loose your job unless you have a good knowledgeable defender and they want the truth to be unveiled.

  4. Pingback: Prof. Marianne H. Skanland Warns About Extensive Government Surveillance in Norway | ARMONIA MAGAZINE - USA

  5. If Jesus tarries, and I live long enough, I think I will end up in jail. Christianity is under attack worldwide. Jesus is quite clear about the events of a great tribulation in Matthew 24. Will that happen in my lifetime? I don’t know. I do know that it will be a very difficult time for the inhabitants on Earth. The news that another government wants increased access to personal information is another sign of the times in which we live.

  6. Looks like the Kingdom of Norway is becoming the Psychological Kingdom of Norway – run by psychos and Barnevernet!
    Very interesting… Didn’t Hitler do something similar in the 1930’s? He manipulated the German people and managed to obtain dictatorial power, for the purpose of “fighting against the communists and other foreign forces”…
    And now the people of Norway will allow Barnevernet to obtain dictatorial power, so that the families will no longer be persecuted behind closed doors but out in the open – with government approval.
    What is the king of Norway saying to all this?…

    • The big question for many in Europe and Norway is the implementation of islam and sharia among us, but there too … you don’t see many activists and demonstrations. In our everyday life the impact going on that don’t relate to them – now or tomorrow – is way ahead of their priority of what they should stand up for.

      Norway is described as paradise for the 2 billion poor people in the world and the 60 million real refugees in the world. This year we assume a 100.000 people will try to enter our country – not necessary either poor or refugee, but filled with knowledge of the socalled good life in Norway.

      Our country is built up as a welfare state. If everything falls apart the state will take care of you. Many of the new arrivers aren’t used to this kind of security. They were accustomed to a culture that said if you don’t have relatives or your own friends that will help you the gutter is the next. From a distance USA also looks somewhat in that way.

      Norway and Europe is in a big change. Some think the welfare state as an institution will fall apart. The oil prices are low and Norway is in a new situation that we must create an economy without oil security. This happens at the same time as the nation is flooded over of people that we don’t know who are or where they are coming from or what they bring with them in the outside and inside luggage. What we do know is that our security in our daily life will be altered – the surveillance will become more effective and laws and regulations will also change.

      The CPS will be of minor interest for common people in this transission. The focus will be on the big questions – avoid civil war – avoid EU to vanish – the economy – the frontiers – the clash of civilizations – the danger for war nation againt nation – a more armed people a.s.o.

      Dagbladet tells us about this in this clip from Londonistan
      http://www.dbtv.no/4052808939001#Londonistan_Religionskrig_i_Londons_bakgater

      • Advise to the families with children living in Norway, where at least one of the parents is an immigrant!
        Take your family and children and get out of Norway before the government takes your freedom and your kids away. Norway may look like a paradise on the outside, but once your freedom and your kids get taken away, that paradise becomes hell on earth. Are you willing to gamble the unity of your family for that so-called “paradise”? Get out from that country and don’t ever look back…

        • You nailed it, Ovidiu. The CPS will target the immigrants. If Knut’s numbers are correct, I only wonder how they will keep up.

    • Du mener visst selve artikkelen som er innledningen til denne tråden? Ja, ok, jeg skal oversette den til norsk, så fort jeg greier – jeg har masse annet jeg er på etterskudd med også! Se etter den norske på min egen hjemmeside. Den kommer til å få en tittel med noe om “total overvåking”, tenker jeg.

      (You probably mean the article which heads this thread? Yes, ok, I will translate it into Norwegian, as fast as I can – I have loads of other stuff which I am behind with too. Look for the Norwegian version on my own home page. It will have a title with something like “total surveillance” in it, probably.)

      • Veldig bra dersom vio får den på norsk også, det er en fordel, for en slike artikel som dette er interessane å legge ut på websider og facebook. Forhåpentligvis tillater du det? Også veldig takknemlig for norsk, der er så mange litt forhøytravende ord, jeg ikke matcher , hvor jeg kommer til kort, så får jeg det på norsk, ungår jeg misforståelser, og det er viktig for meg.

        Mvh. Evgl. Ove Jan Ludvigsen.

      • Veldig bra dersom vio får den på norsk også, det er en fordel, for en slike artikel som dette er interessane å legge ut på websider og facebook. Forhåpentligvis tillater du det?

        Mvh. Evgl. Ove Jan Ludvigsen.

        • Here you are:
          While the church sleeps, the devil is damaging souls with the Babylonian system. Here is a strategy crafted by an occultist who died 65 years ago. Till today, the system she designed is still draging people to hell. What system will you develop to repair these damages and spread the gospel massively?

          THE STRATEGY:- The 10-Point Charter

          PURPOSE: – To change Christian tradition or to redeem the nations of Christian tradition.

          1. TAKE GOD AND PRAYER OUT OF THE EDUCATION SYSTEM

          Change curriculum to ensure that children are freed from the bondage of Christian culture. Why? Because children go to school to be equipped to face life, they are willing to trust and they are willing to value what is being given to them.

          If you take God out of education, they will unconsciously form a resolve that God is not necessary to face life. They will focus on those things the school counts them worthy to be passed on and they will look at God as an additional, if one can afford the additional.

          N.B. Today they introduce Transcendental Meditation (TM) in schools which takes children to altered states of consciousness to meet with demons (spirit guides) = New Age.

          2. REDUCE PARENTAL AUTHORITY OVER THE CHILDREN

          Break the communication between parent and child (Why?). So that parents do not pass on their Christian traditions to their children, liberate children from the bondage of their parent traditions (how?)

          a) Promote excessive child rights; (1997-1998 South Africa introduced Child rights legislation – UNICEF Charter; Today a child is able to say to parent ‘I do not want to hear that, I don’t want to do what you are telling me. Teachers cannot talk to children, children step up and say I have my rights, you cannot talk to me like that).

          b) Abolish corporal punishment; (this has been made law). On the other hand the Bible says “Do not withhold correction from a child, for if you beat him with a rod, he will not die. You shall beat him with a rod and deliver his soul from hell.” (Proverbs 23: 13-14)

          N.B. Jesus said in the last days – wickedness will increase, there will be rebellion and children will not obey their parents. It is not a trend, it is organized.

          c) Teachers are the agents of implementation – from workshops, teachers tell children, “Your parent has no right to force you to pray or read the Bible, you are yourself, have a right of your own, you need to discover yourself, self-expression, self-realization, self-fulfilment are all buzz words.”

          In the West when the child is 7 years, the teachers begin to say to the child “you have a right to choose whether you want to follow the faith of your parents or not, parents are not allowed to enforce their faith upon you.” Question is, what type of decision can a 7 year old make?

          3. DESTROY THE JUDEO-CHRISTIAN FAMILY STRUCTURE

          OR THE TRADITIONAL CHRISTIAN FAMILY STRUCTURE (Why?).

          It is oppressive and that the family is the core of the nation. If you break the family, you break the nation. Liberate the people from the confines of this structure (How?)

          a) Promote sexual promiscuity – free young people to the concept of premarital sex, let them have free sex, lift it so high that the joy of enjoying it (sex) is the highest joy in life, fantasize it, that everybody will feel proud to be seen to be sexually active, even those outside of marriage. This is contrary to the word of God which says “… But fornication and all uncleanness or covetousness, let it not even be named among you, as is fitting for saints… for this you know, that no fornicator, unclean person, nor covetous man, who is an idolater has any inheritance in the kingdom of Christ and God.” (Ephesians 5: 3-5)

          b) Use advertising industry, media – T.V., magazines, film industry to promote sexual enjoyment as the highest pleasure in humanity.

          Have they succeeded? Have they done it? If you want to see whether they have succeeded or not, go to the advertising industry, it does everything to catch your attention and today almost no advert comes out without a sexual connotation. Even when they advertise ice cream, they must show you a thigh of a woman and a bikini, they must do something to set off a trail of thoughts. They will show you more thighs than ice cream. Why? Because, that is what must be in the minds of the people.

          N.B. Advertising industry pops out so much money towards their advertisements to the T.V. and radio.

          4. IF SEX IS FREE, THEN MAKE ABORTION LEGAL AND MAKE IT EASY

          Build clinics for abortion – Health clinics in schools. If people are going to enjoy the joy of sexual relationships, they need to be free of unnecessary fears, in other words they should not be hampered with unwanted pregnancies.

          ‘Abortion as told by Christians is oppressive and denies our rights, we have a right to choose whether we want to have a child or not. If a woman does not want the pregnancy, she should have the freedom to get rid of that pregnancy painless and as easy as possible’. Today it is not only accessible, it is forced. Today abortion is a strategy to curb population control together with the use of condoms and ‘pill’.

          5. MAKE DIVORCE EASY AND LEGAL, FREE PEOPLE FROM THE CONCEPT OF MARRIAGE FOR LIFE.

          Alice wrote over 65 years ago that love has got a mysterious link called the love bond. It is like an ovum that comes out of the ovary, as it travels through your system, it clicks a love favor in you and there’s one other person in the world who can respond to that love bond, when you see that person, everything within you clicks, that is your man/woman, if you miss him, you’ll never be happy until that love bond cycles past, for many years, so for you to be happy get that person at whatever cost, if it means getting him/her out of that marriage, get him/her that is your man/woman. It’s a mistake for him/her to be elsewhere. And if you go together for some time and find that love has died, don’t be held in bondage by the Christian values it will never come back, what you need is an easily arranged divorce and allow another love bond to come forth, just like an ovum comes up, and when it comes forth you’ll enjoy life again. On the contrary God’s word says in Malachi 2: 16; “For the Lord God of Israel says that He hates divorce…”

          N.B. People enter into marriage having signed contracts of how they will share their things after divorce. People enter with one foot and another behind. In the past, divorce was unthinkable. It is one thing for a marriage to fail but it is another thing for people to enter marriage with an intention to enjoy as long as it was enjoyable and to walk out of it.

          6. MAKE HOMOSEXUALITY AN ALTERNATIVE LIFESTYLE

          Alice Bailey preached (over 65 years ago) that sexual enjoyment is the highest pleasure in humanity, no one must be denied and no one must be restricted how to enjoy themselves. People should be allowed in whichever way they chose they want, whether it is homosexuality or in incest or bestiality, as long as the two agree.

          In the world today so many laws have been made that promote homosexuality and give so much freedom to gay rights, that a time will come when it is illegal for a preacher to mention homosexuality as an abomination in the eyes of God, or to read scriptures publicly that talk about homosexuality. At the International scene, Western nations now sanction African countries that have resisted homosexuality, with threats of withdrawing foreign aid and investments. Today many churches marry gays/lesbians and ordain gay priests.

          According to the Bible, this is an abomination before the eyes of God.

          “Thou shalt not lie with mankind, as with womankind: it [is] abomination.” (Leviticus 18:22)

          “If a man also lie with mankind, as he lieth with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination: they shall surely be put to death; their blood [shall be] upon them. (Leviticus 20:13)

          7. DEBASE ART, MAKE IT RUN MAD

          How? Promote new forms of art which will corrupt and defile the imagination of people because art is the language of the spirit, that which is inside, you can bring out in painting, music, drama etc. Look at the quality of the music that is coming out, the films out of Hollywood.

          8. USE MEDIA TO PROMOTE AND CHANGE MINDSET

          The greatest channel you need to use to change human attitude is media. Use the press, the radio, T.V, cinema. You can tell today how successful they have been in implementing the plan over 65 years via media as well as advertising agencies, billboards, magazines. Who controls media? (New Age). So much money is pumped into media and advertising spreading of pornographic material and other sources. Sex outside of marriage is thrown on your face 80-90 times than sex in marriage. Promiscuity is being promoted as natural, you watch gay sex on T.V. in homes where children’s minds are being neutralized to sensitivity to these things. You wonder why newspapers, T.V, etc do not record anything about Christian activities.

          9. CREATE AN INTERFAITH MOVEMENT

          Promote other faiths to be at par with Christianity, and break this thing about Christianity as being the only way to heaven, by that Christianity will be pulled down and other faiths promoted. She said promote the importance of man in determining his own future and destiny – HUMANISM. She said tell man he has the right to choose what he wants to be and he can make it happen, he has the right to determine his cause – this takes God off His throne. Interfaith movements are rising everywhere in the world today.

          10. GET GOVERNMENTS TO MAKE ALL THESE LAW AND GET THE CHURCH TO ENDORSE THESE CHANGES.

          The church must change its doctrine and accommodate the people by accepting these things and put them into its structures and systems.

          Have they succeeded?

          Today you wonder why our governments are legislating laws contrary to the Bible and why the church is compromising the Word of God. It is a process of implementing The Plan – A 50 year strategy of the New Age Movement to fulfil its ultimate goal to establish a One World Government, a One World Economic system and a One World Religion. Today the strategy almost in its entirety has been adopted by the United Nations and today a lot of it is already law in many nations. This deception has crept up unobserved on so many people. It can best be demonstrated through the well-known analogy of the frog in the pot of water. If you put a frog in a pot of boiling water, it is smart enough to know that it is in terrible danger and will immediately jump out to safety. But if you turn up the heat very slowly, a little at a time, it doesn’t notice the changes that are taking place and will slowly cook to death. Many people today are slowly cooking to death and don’t seem to realize how far they have come from where they once were.

          Today the Western World is not struggling to resist these because the New Age Movement focused primarily on the West because that was the Christian world in the 19th century. The New Age Movement has a school called the Akanni School, which is the school of all the leaders of the Western world. They subscribe to it. It is recorded that they say they have succeeded the task in the West but suddenly they realize Christianity has migrated to the rest of the world, so they have now to use every resource in the West to deal with the rest of the world. In Africa, South Africa is the number one state, it is changing at such a rapid speed. They are saying give to African States a financial package with conditions to:

          Legalize abortion
          Take God and prayer out of school

          Governments are so attracted to this package, they can’t say no to it, they need the money, and they ask the church to find an answer. These are done secretly. Christianity is 5%, the rest is Hinduism, Buddhism, and Spiritism. New Age is being taught to teachers, they are being taught to teach this in schools.

          It is interesting to note that Blavatsky, Besant and Alice Bailey (1880 -1949) were well known Masonic leaders of the day. Albert Pike referred to Freemasonry as the ‘custodian’ or special guardian of these occult secrets and revealed the hidden agenda of his institution, the forming of a Luciferic One World Government.

        • I am familiar with all of these occultists, Knut. They would be happy to see that your employer is doing a very good job at achieving point #2.

        • Yes, Chris, but I think the spirit of time move in just these 10 points in your backyard too. With your last name known I found a happy version of Frank Zappa. Do what you think is right, Chris. I’m not your oponent and all the same it will be interesting to see how fare and what results activism not based on truth, but emotions – may make.

        • You seem to agree with my statement about your employer.

          Signs of the occult are appearing everywhere in America, even in some of the churches. However, it is obvious that the problem is much worse in your country.

          How does my name relate to Frank Zappa?

          We are opponents.

          My activism is based on facts published in many different sources. It is not based on my emotions, though I don’t know how anyone can read the stream of stories coming out of Norway and not get emotional.

        • The spirit of time sweeps over our nations as a whole. Regarding Zappa – of cause – not the name, but the resemblance in your look.

          As I said – you can of cause do what you want. If this make us opponents I sure can live with that.
          Yes, I have tried to warn you about the place you fill in as the truth of information. You don’t have the truth, but you choose to activate it based on information from chronic CPS-haters. That’s your choice. The stream of stories could have been collected in many other countries – if they had activists too. The stories are for the most part one-eyed and not telling the whole story – the story behind the interventions of the CPS.
          Hmmm… by googling your name I found out a lot about you and your family. A lot more than we usually do with a name in Norway. I could buy the criminal record and other personal information about you for a couple of dollars – back disabled? If I had lived in your backyard the first thing I would have done was to change my name to … Will Smith … or .. Bill Johnson.

        • Knut, you are either blind or devious. Feel free to spend a couple of dollars on my personal information. I have no criminal record (as Christianity isn’t a criminal offense…yet) and I my back is not disabled. I have never claimed disability from the government for any reason. I like my name and I will not be intimidated to change it.

        • OK – you know you looks better than I – and – maybe?? – I know the inside of the CPS in Norway ( a little) better than these chronics living in the past? The conversation with mr. Zappa isn’t quite off the topic. I think a pre-investigation on the internet tell a lot more about a person in the USA than in Norway – in spite of the number of inhabitants.

        • And honestly, the only physical similarity I see between me and Mr. Zappa is our build (but I think he was taller than me) and the moustache.

        • I’m not going to listen to the video, as I have already checked out a bio of Mr. Zappa.

          You wrote:

          ” I know the inside of the CPS in Norway ( a little) better than these chronics living in the past?”

          You were correct to put a question mark at the end as it appears that you are asking yourself the question. This is appropriate since we all know who the medieval one is here.

          You are free to find out as much about me as possible. The only problem is that much of what you have posted here is inaccurate. Why would anyone believe what you say about me? However, I may or many not answer any questions about my life depending on what they are.

          At the same time, you appear to be digressing and threatening to make personal information available to the public. Have you been taking lessons from the Norwegian government?

        • Knut, I have concluded that you are devious.

          I’ve changed my mind on your questioning of me.

          If you “speak” to me directly, don’t expect a reply.

          Anyone can spend a couple of dollars and find out about me.

        • Hello Chris,
          Why are you loose your time with Knut?
          To be taken back in his world? We don’t have common points to talk with him. He is to ignorant and don’t value wisdom, his definition of wisdom iso from Karl Marx philosophical way of life. He is one of those new man created by the Norwegians Society. The wolf want to separate and lead the pray in his territory where he can have the upper hand. We don’t know details about his world because we don’t waste our time dwelling in it. The things we know about are not attractive to us. We did enough to show to the world about Norway trough Knot eyes. Frank Zappa, Lady Gaga, Frank Sinatra, Knut…….. are not part of our circle. God bless you my friend.

        • Thank you, Aristotel for your kind words.

          Have you heard the expression, “Give a person enough rope and they will hang themselves?”

          I don’t think my time with Knut was a waste. I wanted to learn just how far he would go as I had him pegged quite awhile ago. I was not aware of this “new man” that you speak of. It sounds like something Hitler was trying to create. I was curious about Knut. Now that he has made remarks about delving into my personal life (which is open for all to see) in an improper way, he has gone the way of Marx and Stalin (who were far from Christians btw).

          To understand what a person’s thoughts are, you have to go where they are at times and not be influenced, of course. I have been there and done that now and I can see clearly what we are dealing with. All one has to do is look up the definition of the word “devious” and its synonyms: underhanded, deceitful, dishonest, dishonorable, unethical, unprincipled, immoral, unscrupulous, fraudulent, dubious, unfair, treacherous, and duplicitous. This is Knut.

          I will try (though I’ll be tempted to learn more) not to reply to Knut’s comments. I do not want to spend anymore time in his world as you say. It is an evil world.

          God’s blessings my friend…

  7. Knut
    You are trying to downplay the harm barnevernet are doing by taking too many children away from parents who could have been helped instead. I don`t know if you understand how devastating it is for a child to be taken away from its parents (unless they were really really bad) and for parents to be robbed of their child. If it had happened to me I don`t know if I`d survive. Just the thought of it makes me shudder! It is terrible!

    From reading on the social media, I have the impression that many parents in Norway are afraid of seeking help when they are in need of it because they are afraid that barnevernet then will take their children away. Their fears are not unfounded. Various newspapers etc. on the net tell stories about parents who have had their child/children confiscated by barnevernet because either the parents were dealing with health issues or a child had serious health issues. Children are taken away and placed in fostercare on all kinds of other flimsy grounds as well. Instead of doing all barnevernet can and spend their resources in helping both parents and children, they tear parents and children apart and cause more harm than they help. What do you do with the parents, for instance, who fall into depression and maybe suicidal thoughts after losing their children? Are they nothing worth and totally forgotten by barnevernet? Isn`t it best to help everybody so that nobody takes harm?

    • Veldig bra dersom vio får den på norsk også, det er en fordel, for en slike artikel som dette er interessane å legge ut på websider og facebook. Forhåpentligvis tillater du det?

      Mvh. Evgl. Ove Jan Ludvigsen.

  8. Norway’s way of life is just preparing their people to be crushed by Islam. Is better for my flesh to be crushed than my soul. What will be the loss for the Norwegians after loosing their soul ? A handful of dust. The world is a spiritual would. Doesn’t matter the colors: communists, nazi, muslims, Norwegians. Whoever embrace the philosophy of perdition will have the same end. Satan is the king. He want to dominate the world creating the new man. The perfect one was created in the beginning, but he failed. God’s love trying to redeem his crown creation trough his Son Jesus Christmas but who accept him? How many problems can be solved if we obey to love God and our neighbors. When neighbors are selling each other there is no love. I think this is what happens in Norway. Too much coldness outside and inside.

    • Amen, Aristotel.

      It seems like many who call themselves Christians in Norway rarely think of their souls. This is a worldwide problem but, as Group noted in their VBS program, Norway is a very dark place in spite of the fact that a large percentage consider themselves to be members of the Church of Norway.

      • We have a couple in our home church from Finland and I ask them about the church in Norway and they told me that Norway is a very liberal country and the church is a joke. I asked a second time and they said you heard me clear, it is a joke. They are teaching at Oregon State University and they are very good Christians loving the Lord and being in good relationship with Jesus and all the people. I could see the pain telling me about that. So, I don’t speak lightly about bad situations. God love Norway but doesn’t accept the sinful life they live.

        • You are right, Aristotel. The state church in Norway is, in my opinion, a fallen church indeeed! Many priests don`t even believe in Jesus Christ. The most important mission they have is to make everyone accept same-sex marriage. It is really sad….

        • Thank you Hildi,
          Is time for us to pray for a revival in Norway. This situation explain everything about Norway’s problems. You cannot expect anything else from such a bad environment. When this kind of wickedness is forced on normal people and they create a hostile terrorizing way of life by creating laws to enforce it, is time to run to preserve your soul. They like to kidnap innocent, unadulterated kids for their own purpose and the kidnappers have money and power to do it. Wow, I understand now more than I want to understand. This society is incorrigible. The kingdom of Satan on earth.

        • Yes Chris, you right, but the difference is that what the communists couldn’t do the Norwegian government learned, changed the tactics and forced on people by the power of money. Do you see the common denominator? The same pattern. Freedom and constraints in the direction of hell. Few of them will stand but will be only the ones in close relationships with the Son of God, Prince of Peace Jesus Christ.

        • Yes Aristotel, I see the common denominator.

          And I also see the similarity to the church of Laodicea:

          15 “‘I know your deeds, that you are neither cold nor hot; I wish that you were cold or hot. 16 So because you are lukewarm, and neither hot nor cold, I will spit you out of My mouth. 17 Because you say, ‘I am rich, and have become wealthy, and have need of nothing,’ and you do not know that you are wretched and miserable and poor and blind and naked…” -Revelation 3

        • Yes I know that passage from scriptures and I totally agree with you. It is a very good description of what is the church in Norway but also know that in Norway are some good Christians too. They are the ones that suffer for not bending under the wicked one . God love them and one day we will be together enjoying and the only thing we will do will be worshipping our creator.

        • Amen, Aristotel.

          10 “Blessed are those who have been persecuted for the sake of righteousness, for theirs is the kingdom of heaven.” Matthew 5

        • I am not a mind reader, Knut, but now it seems you are mocking Christians when you have claimed to be one yourself. Christians don’t hide themselves in a bubble; they are unable to according to Jesus:

          14 “You are the light of the world. A city set on a hill cannot be hidden; 15 nor does anyone light a lamp and put it under a basket, but on the lampstand, and it gives light to all who are in the house.” – Matthew 5

        • I am not mocking, but I read you as Christians living in a bubble where you see the world and the society as if it should be cloned with inhabitants just like you. Our societies are not made up of copies of ourselves – they are made up of people who are ( for the most part) free to choose the lives and values that they find important. We as Christians are – as I have said a couple of times – ourselves in spirit, soul and body wherever we walk through a daily life in the society around us wether it’s secular or christian. We participate either we witness – are role models – or have gotten the idea that to fight against one CPS in the world is our main purpose in life.

        • It is a crazy way to learn, but you keep on teaching me, Knut.

          You have gotten Christianity backwards.

          You wrote:

          “I read you as Christians living in a bubble where you see the world and the society as if it should be cloned with inhabitants just like you. Our societies are not made up of copies of ourselves – they are made up of people who are ( for the most part) free to choose the lives and values that they find important.”

          Christians see each person as uniquely created, each with their own personalities and gifts. There is no cloning in the Bible.

          You wrote:

          ” We as Christians are – as I have said a couple of times – ourselves in spirit, soul and body wherever we walk through a daily life in the society around us wether it’s secular or christian.”

          So, you continue to claim to be a Christian. Only God knows your heart, but your lack of insight and wisdom, as shown in this entire blog, gives you a huge lack of credibility.

          You wrote:

          “We participate either we witness – are role models – or have gotten the idea that to fight against one CPS in the world is our main purpose in life.”

          Christians know that fighting against your employer is not the main purpose in life. It has become a part of life for some of us.

          By your comments, Knut, you have proved yourself to wittingly or unwittingly be a puppet for your employer. You are not a role model.

  9. I wrote a long comment. But as I went into the topic that all the ministers in Norway were bielderberger, all my comment dissapaired before I was able to post it. I was away for a secund to cheak up the information, but I had also did that many times without this happened.

    It’s hard to write everything over again. So I will now just say it more chortly. And next time I write all first another place before I post it.
    It might be the very topic in moniton.

    What I wrote is that how come the covernment in Norway not doing anything, exept getting the CPS wurst inspite of all critics of the destruktive system? Who runs them? Are they that much idiot? Why is the system in the western country that is influenced by usa system? And by new world orden and aganda 21. A satanistisc orden. That kill and use children in the wurst ways and want to make popularion much less on earth? Why is it that the most rish country are most milked mostly?

    How can false medisin and false diagnoses thretens people to cooperation? This is freakently used against children taken of CPS. Maybe also used against some good politics to take they away? The threaten is always there. The chemicals they forse on people with addictivity makes them looks sick. When it is a normal reaction on chemical drugs. They urn on this too.

    To stop the CPS it needs to also be ripped of it’s roots. Stop illuminati and the satanistisc order before it is too late. They are criminals in high positions. And seems to dictate a number of countries. These richer, these more money to steel. And milk off.

    We people are many. They are few. Stop the criminals. Take down thair destroying system. And thair lies. Before they chanching the rools more and more devistating day by day. Take over the politics and stop thair madness and tell everybody. Tell a friend. Let the truth out. We are more people than them. And thair lies keeps this alive. Let everybody know.

  10. A new hospital without medisin have finally been open in Norway. They have proves that this diagnoses and medisin are false. Actually the same chemicals are used on solders and under war. To make them energic and aggressive. And less touchy.

    It’s possible to fight this system from the outside and to use this hospital without medisin for the children they have take and forse this on.

    It’s also passible to buy a little iland somewhere as children that has grow up and come home can be with you to go through the abstinensses form the addictive medisin of chemicals till they become normal again. It use to take 4-6 mounths. Without they come with new medisin to keep the bad spiral going on. Some people die if this. They used this as a weapon. A way to use children even more and to threaten people to cooperate.

    I’m very happy for this new hospital that can take this threaten away.

    Through CPS they also tryes to take over the personal economy to grown up children at CPS so they loses thair freedom. And to parents to more easely make them a target that can’t hide away. The money is in the stat, not among the people. We have less. So little that often both parents are forsed to work. And so that we become depended of the stat. In that way they get more power.

    They try to destroy the union and strength of family. They even making also other laws in the country that has intentions to keeps family appart. The bank also controls a lot with thair rools witch are owned by the same people.

    They give for example loan for buying house to cupple, but not patent and adult children some of them as a law. Why? They say it is because they might not keep on living together. But it is more commen that cupples comes into fights than family so thair argument has no value.

    Why do they want family appart and why are they using children? Why do they only think about how them self can win on this as they let the countries in ruins? It’s a global thing and it helps to consentrate on the roots of the problem. Othervise we might be kickboksing to the air. But thank you very much other countries for caring. It’s the right thing to do to try to stop this system. These more people that knows these better. With thousand on thousands to millions we get stronger to stop this madness. We only need to get many many.

    Norway is a Christian country and two generations ago it was more. The politics have worked 100 years to take it away. Now they have finally succed by taken it away as stat religion.

    Jesus was born in a jewish world to give them a message. Some of them didn’t want to take his message and look on what he did and standed for. Witch was only good things and as a good ideal. Why not? Why is it that the free bielder masion was build at the slavery of the old Egypt? The users mind from that time, are still going on through CPS. Wilde Jesus learned us to be kind and with truth, love and forgiveness and pease. To shere and to give. To be free and secure. He stoped killing and other hurrible things. Such as hard pannishment and cruelity and to djuge others. He try to learn people to forgive and love.

    Why does it matter so much if he was the son of god or not. Why should we care? Well I believe he was? But why would that be an argument for not fallowing his example of goodness. He never used power on anybody or forse.

  11. I have a question for anyone here who knows the answer.

    Does the state church in Norway collect a state tax from members as happens in Switzerland?

    • I know this is off topic, but I found this at the pew research center’s site:

      “An increasing number of Germans – Protestant and Catholic alike – are leaving their churches, according to statistics compiled by The Wall Street Journal. Among the reasons cited for the decrease in membership is an unwillingness to pay a de facto increase in Germany’s church tax, which is collected by the government from registered members of churches to fund those religious organizations.

      “The fact that church taxes even exist might surprise Americans, as the U.S. Constitution’s First Amendment prohibits the government from collecting taxes for religious groups.”

      A graphic there shows that the Swiss and the Norwegians don’t pay a church tax but then states:

      “In Switzerland, church taxes are imposed at the canton level; most of the 26 cantons, or states, collect a church tax in some form.”

      and then I found this:

      “Norway disestablished the state church, the Evangelical Lutheran Church of Norway, in 2012 but this is largely symbolic since its financial privileges are retained.

      The option of supporting religious bodies through membership dues was rejected and state funding is to continue. Norway funds the Lutheran Church — and the others — through general tax revenues. It offers the same amount of money per member to each religious denomination. However, as citizens are considered to be members of Lutheran church, unless they explicitly state otherwise, it profits from being the default option. And although the King is no longer formally the head of the Lutheran Church with the right to nominate its bishops, the ruler is still obliged to be a Lutheran. Furthermore, the state keeps on paying the salaries of the Lutheran clergy, their pensions and the upkeep of their churches.”

      Thus: “Denmark, Finland Sweden and Iceland have a direct church tax, whereas Norway subsidizes religious bodies on a per capita basis from general tax revenue.”

      http://www.concordatwatch.eu/showkb.php?kb_header_id=33981&kb_id=34701&org_id=1551&infoXpg=2

      So, I have my answer.

      If this is incorrect, will someone let me know?

    • I think I found the answer for my own question.

      “Norway disestablished the state church, the Evangelical Lutheran Church of Norway, in 2012 but this is largely symbolic since its financial privileges are retained.

      The option of supporting religious bodies through membership dues was rejected and state funding is to continue. Norway funds the Lutheran Church — and the others — through general tax revenues. It offers the same amount of money per member to each religious denomination. However, as citizens are considered to be members of Lutheran church, unless they explicitly state otherwise, it profits from being the default option. And although the King is no longer formally the head of the Lutheran Church with the right to nominate its bishops, the ruler is still obliged to be a Lutheran. Furthermore, the state keeps on paying the salaries of the Lutheran clergy, their pensions and the upkeep of their churches.”

      Thus, “Denmark, Finland Sweden and Iceland have a direct church tax, whereas Norway subsidizes religious bodies on a per capita basis from general tax revenue.”

      http://www.concordatwatch.eu/showkb.php?kb_header_id=33981&kb_id=34701&org_id=1551&infoXpg=2

      If you reside in Norway and this information is incorrect, would you let me know?

      • If this information is true, that “the state keeps on paying the salaries of the Lutheran clergy, their pensions and the upkeep of their churches,” it is quite disturbing.

        With a “system” like this, there would be financial incentives to remain silent on important issues. The more I find out about Norway, the more unique it becomes. I have put the country on the prayer list at my church and will continue to pray for the people of Norway.

      • The priests in Norway do serve the CPS. Some are involved in CPS-related work. The church is divided between the advocates of homosexuality, CPS and feminism and the believers who think the Bible is the word of God. In Norway the Church’ City Mission (Kirkens Bymisjon) are doing business with Barnevernet by running houses where parents and children who have been forcibly separated, are allowed to see oneanother for an hour or two under supervision. Every word is written down, and the workers stalk the family to the bathroom. Whispering is not allowed. I lost visitation rights with my daughter because I was acvused of whispering to her when I helped her in the bathroom behind locked door, The CPS were frantic.

        The demonic church is Norway is an affront to mankind. They embrace sin in all forms. They only care about pleasure. Except parents are not allowed to enjoy the company of their children and vice versa. Knut is exact copy of the people working in the Barnevernet. They are all the same; mechanical robots with no emotions.

        • You have been one of those I have thought about during these past few weeks, Cecilie. I can only imagine what you have gone through.

          Martin Luther would start another reformation if he were alive in Norway today. A Christian doesn’t embrace sin, only the ungodly do. With things as they are there, those who believe and follow the teachings of the Bible must be a small minority. Your description of the CPS and the church in Norway can only be called “evil.”

          God bless you.

        • I have had the privilage to grow up in a Christian home, but as many others I as a young man postponed my personal comittment to become a born again till the spring of 1981. My wife had been a Christian for some months and I could no longer hold it back.

          The first thing we did as saved was to withdraw our membership in the Norwegian Church. The priest who signed the withdrawal was frustrated when we told him that we were not members of any organized church – we attended a socalled house congregation and we have never since been closer to living in the acts of the apostles. The priest knew we were Christians indeed, but with a sad glance he wrote us out as people that didn’t belong anywere in a Christian context.

          The Norwegian Church has though the years been a political tool for the spirit of time. You find both Christians and atheist priests. We live in times were the first commandment for a long time have been under serious attack. People are mixed up and have for the most part no personal relationship with the living God. I heard a priest talking on the radio in the car some days a go in what we call “andakt” – a sharing of the word of God – she spoke of mindfulness and yoga and said not one word from the bible.

          I really hope we now with the multicultural society come to discussion there we end this financing of the work tool for the spirit of time. Members who believe should of cause finance their own church. In Norway all religious congregations are being given money from a the state according to how many members they have. I know a man who have called his family a chuch and gets money from the state. The Bodnariu’s could be a chuch of 9 members or more if the wanted. The muslims and all other religious people than Christians – also the arrivers – find this financial system as a gift.

          The best part of the church is the work done in wings like Kirkens Bymisjon. Here is a link to information given over their activities
          http://www.bymisjon.no/Support/English-Site/Our-work/

        •   
          Mr Nygaard considers “The best part of the church is the work done in wings like Kirkens Bymisjon.”

          It should be noted that Kirkens Bymisjon support and abet the CPS.

          I find the tendency to convert the issue of this thread into a discussion of various Norwegian churces or congregations or brands of Christianity of personal experiences of it, unfortunate; it waters out the original concern, no doubt intentionally on the part of Mr Nygaard.

      •   
        I have nothing much to contribute to any discussion of churches, except this:

        Yes, churches and their members are as they are. But I don’t think of the church(es) as theirs. It is Christ’s church.

        It is perhaps a catholic-like way of looking at it (don’t get too agitated now!)? That the coming together in a church is in itself sanctifying, a blessing, like the way a sacrament carries its blessing in itself.
          

        •   
          Since this is Palm Sunday (it has started here in Norway and Europe, and will gradually get to you people in America), I would like to wish you all, and all the people we think about, a blessed Easter.
            

        • On my email I have received information of activity on a comment I made in Aftenposten one of the days before last years Easter. The article I commented had the title: “The true meaning of Easter”. I wrote this – I just copy it:
          Årsaken til at Jesus kom var at han skulle beseire Satan og gjøre ham maktesløs. Det som skjedde når mennesket ved Adam falt i synd var at foruten å dø åndelig, så ble det også en trell under djevelen. Djevelen stjal kontrakten som mennesket hadde fått av Gud. Mennsket havnet i åndelig fattigdom og død. Før syndefallet så fantes ingen sykdom. Så snart mennesket hadde fallet begynte sykdom, hat, opprør og alt negativt å manifistere seg. Det var djevelens natur som hadde kommet over mennesket.

          Så kom Jesus. Han ble føst til denne jord avlet av den Hellige Ånd og født av jiomfru Maria og på denne måten ble han som det står i Hebr. 2, 14 og 14 : “Siden barna er mennesker av kjøtt og blod, måtte også han bli menneske som de. Slik skulle han ved sin død gjøre ende på ham som hersker ved døden, det er djelvelen, og befri dem som av frykt for døden var i trelldom hele sitt liv.” Jesus hadde en jordisk mor og en himmelsk far.

          Iblant tror vi at Jesus kom bare for å vise oss at han var Guds sønn, men det er ikke hele sannheten. Han var 100% Gud og 100% menneske. Jesus sier i Mark. 10,45 følgende om seg selv: “For Menneskesønnen har ikke kommet for å la seg tjene, men for selv å tjene og gi sitt liv i løsepenge for mange.”

          Hva hendte på korset? Ikke noe menneske …ingen humanisme…ingen nyåndelighet ..ingen pasifisme…ingen sosialisme..kunne løse mennesket ut …Jesus kom for å dø. Rom. 6,23 sier at: “Syndens lønn er døden, men Guds nådes gave er evig liv i Kristus Jesus, vår Herre.”

          Altså kom Jesus, Guds sønn, som både var Gud og menneske. Han var 100% menneske og kunne derfor dø som menneskehetens representant. Han var 100% Gud og var derfor uten synd og kunne derfor død en stedfortrendende død…for deg …og for meg. Han var uskyldig, men tok på seg alle andres synd; et syndoffer.

          “For the cross”

        • Thank you for the kind wishes, Marianne.

          I think about the church as the true followers of Jesus Christ worldwide and that Christian fellowship is very important. I feel we have had some fellowship on this blog, over the internet.

          I also wish you and those who have been following this issue a blessed Easter week.

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