I never intended to turn this site into an anti-CPS blog when I started out. I meant to focus on theology, discernment in the church, and topics about the Christian struggle with the world. But when I heard about what Barnevernet did to the Bodnariu family I started writing articles to inform my friends about the situation. Unexpectedly, visitors from all over the world like professor Marianne Skanland arrived here leaving well-informed and well researched information. Mr Knut Nygaard who represents the Norwegian CPS has also been a regular commentator, and he has given us front row sitting and insight into how Barnevernet thinks and works.
Thank you to all who shared and reblogged these posts. Your effort was not in vain, because the Bodnariu family has been reunited and world is now beginning to ask questions about CPS practices in Norway and other European countries.
Here are a few statistics:
Total visitors: 500,193
Visitors in 2016: 308,000
By country in 2016:
|United States 127,792|
|United Kingdom 14,449|
|Czech Republic 4,334|
Comments (big thank you to all commentators and contributors!):
Chris Reimers 1,249
Marianne Skanland 769
Knut Nygaard 720
Pavla Jansova 308
And many others to reach the total of 8,285 comments!
Top internet search terms: bodnariu case, barnevernet norway, ruth bodnariu
Top referring sites: facebook, twitter, AgnusDei, barzilaiendan
We did it for the children. Thank you all for participating on Delight in Truth.
“Let the little children come to me, and do not hinder them, for the kingdom of God belongs to such as these.” -Jesus (Mark 10;14)
Triumphal March from Aida
A gdzie jest reszta ?, zwolnieni z uczestnictwa sa tylko ci przebywajacy na wakacjach.
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To jest moja uwaga dla przesluchujacych muzyke – najpierw wylaczcie automatyczne tlumaczenie , dopiero wtedy kliknijcie na link
I PROSBA O ZWROT DZIECI DO BIOLOGICZNYCH RODZIN
Nabucco – Hebrew Slavs Chorus
Nie wiedzialam ,ze ludzie tak lubia Florence Foster Jenkins.
I so appreciate your blog, Delight. It wasn’t long ago that you had slowed your blogging efforts because not much was happening on this front. You were busy with other things. Besides your work, you were maintaining a site where Theologians could learn from one another.
I also recall suddenly getting many emails from your blog as I was following it. I got curious enough to come here and find out what the discussion was about. It wasn’t long before it was obvious that something was very wrong with an institution that is supposed to care for our most valuable asset apart from our faith and the scripture that teaches us a truth that is unique, our children.
I believe this because of words you have shared in this post:
“Let the little children come to me, and do not hinder them, for the kingdom of God belongs to such as these.” -Jesus (Mark 10;14)
This verse reminds me of another:
“Truly I say to you, unless you are converted and become like children, you will not enter the kingdom of heaven.” -Jesus (Matthew 18:3)
I came to the conversation late, but I love children. It is the reason I have been active here.
A neighbor happened to stumble across my path today and we discussed many problems in our own backyard as Knut would have us do. I mentioned the Norway problem but didn’t spend a great deal of time on it as my neighbor had other interests. I learned a lot from him and I hope he learned something from me.
I have learned a great deal from being here the past several months. Like you, Delight, I wish we could leave this subject completely and discuss other matters. For some reason, I am drawn to this philosophic problem that has done so much damage. We can’t leave it alone.
One wonderful Christian mentioned that she didn’t feel comfortable commenting here but I think she is as concerned about this issue as anyone. She didn’t feel that she was doing anything to help and that she wished she could do more. She told me that she prays about the situations you have posted on this blog. I hope she felt what I did as I responded to her. People like her are the most important. As a Christian, I will always believe that. The humble childlike prayers of God’s people will always make a difference.
God’s blessings to you and your family, Delight…
Gratuluje sukcesu Chris.Udalo Wam sie dotrzec z bardzo wazna informacja do wielu osob.
Czytalam Twoj dzisiejszy wpis o prasie.Mam takie skojarzenia.Im wieksza nienawisc w wypowiedziach politykow tym wieksza szansa , ze ze spoleczenstwa wyloni sie nowy Breivik .Tworzy sie spirala nienawisci..I tu polecam ksiazke ,, Laserman – historia szwedzkiej nienawisci ,, Ksiazka nagrodzona ,bardzo dobrze opisujaca stan swiadomosci szwedzkiego spoleczenstwa.Otoz zyjac w Polsce nie sadzilam ,ze w dzisiejszym swiecie jest tyle rasizmu.Bylam przekonana , ze rasizm zmarl dawno temu w Ameryce.Tu w Norwegii przekonalam sie ,ze zyje i tu i jeszcze w wielu innych krajach.I ze jest bardzo wiele osob , ktore zdolne sa do walki , zeby przetrwal.Z wrogimi – w stosunku do obcych pogladami ,probuje sie zmierzyc ksiazka Motgift.- tylko kto po nia siegnal.
O upadku apartheidu i brutalnosci policji w RPA napisal ksiazke ,,Sluszny opor ,, Peter Harris..30 lat po upadku apartheidu w RPA w dalszym ciagu biali nie przyjaznia sie z czarnymi.Apartheid tkwi gleboko w naszej swiadomosci.Sytuacja zmienia sie szybko ,zyjemy w czasach ogromnych fal emigracyjnych (obecnie jest 65 milionow uchodzcow ) ale w swiadomosci mamy stare podzialy , przesady , budowane na juz nieaktualnej sytuacji.Mysle , ze taka dyskusja jak ta tutaj pomaga zrozumiec jak roznie ludzie mysla i znalezc jednak jakies wspolne kompromisy .Model zycia dogodny dla wielu z roznych stron i o roznych pogladach , ktorzy musza zyc razem.
Jezeli masz cos ciekawego do przekazania to nie przepraszaj nas , ze zajmujesz tu miejsce.Zawsze chetnie sobie poczytamy.Wiedzy nigdy dosyc.
Jaspis has right about one thing – Knuta don’t know much about blog visitations, but I have learned one thing – one visit is … one visit and when the same person visits again – an hour later – it’s visit number two – and then again ….
Yes, it’s 500.000 visitations done by ??? people? My guess – between 1000 and 5000, but mostly done by a hard core of 50 guests.
Relax, Knut. I just looked up the numbers of views generated by unique visitors. About 310,000 unique visitors generated 500,000 views over 3.5 years.
So you were only off by a factor of 1000!
I hope you are able to guess better in your line of work.
Remember, most traffic arrives here from Facebook and it depends on people sharing with friends
Blogging – sharing – without knowing who you are blogging with – as f.i. Jaspis – without knowing what they are sharing as the comments from Gabriela – and without knowledge of Norway, Norwegians and the CPS as a whole is a vulnerable project, but sharing faith – in a time like this – should be more appropriate for believers.
But blogging make us international – heard this one by McGuiness Flint made way back in 1970 before blogging was thought of as the coming way of communicating – an emotional little piece called “International” with this lyric:
Hey, Jesus hey it’s me
Well I’ve gone international
And become very rational
As you decree
Hey, Jesus it’s our day
How I can bring them home to you
Though I may loose out on a few
Who care to stray
We’ll make them see international
We’ll make them be international
Like you and me
Hey, Jesus it’s OK
Now we have common interests
And we can help along the rest
To be like we
We’ll make them see international
We’ll make them be international
Like you and me
Hey, Jesus you’ll agree
They’re going downhill very fast
And it don’t look as though
they’ll last till judgement day
We’ll make them see international
We’ll make them be international
Like you and me
I have been one voice sharing information to people that are very emotional to us all. We all made it through the storm and seen under all -hardly one comment was under the belt.
I visited one of my two daugheters some days ago and she showed my some new family pictures taken by this photographer, Chris ..
Panie Knut , akurat w to ze pan zyje naprawde – to wierze , niestety zyja tacy ludzie jak pan .Choc calkowicie rozumiem Olsena , ktory mowi o panu -zmora , bo pan jest jak nocny koszmar.
Probuje pan obnizyc liczbe osob odwiedzajacych ten blog.Pisal pan nie tak dawno , ze to jakies 50 -1oo osob dziennie . .Zwrocilam panu uwage , ze nie ma pan daru dobrej oceny sytuacji.To moze wynikac z braku inteligencji , jest to czesta cecha Norwegow.
Ale piszac to , wcale nie mialam na mysli frekwencji tutaj , raczej swoje plany na polepszenie tej frekwencji.Bo nie wiem , czy zwrocil pan uwage jaki zawod wykonywalam .Dystrybutor produktow finansowych , polis ubezpieczeniowych i funduszy emerytalnych.Taki czlowiek troche wie o zasadach dystrybucji a do tego ma przewaznie spora grupe znajomych.
Ale rozumiem , ze strategia pana jest permanentne obnizanie wartosci rozmowcy.Mala frekwencja, stare poglady , ktos ma zalozyc okulary.Nie odpowiada pan na wazne pytania ,nawet jak sa zadane w pana jezyku.Straszy pan ludzi , albo lepiej probuje zastraszac ,.Zwraca pan ( nie proszony o to )uwage doroslym ludziom czym maja sie zajmowac.Wie pan to ja decyduje co mnie interesuje – a nie pan.Krotko – dziala pan na mnie jak wrzod na d…
I dziwie sie Norwegii , ze chce przeznaczac tak duzo pieniedzy na firme w ktorej pan pracuje i na pensje dla ( przepraszam , ale musze to napisac) idiotow , ktorzy tam pracuja .Bo jak na razie to efekt tych inwestycji jest dla Norwegii oplakany.Ale cos mi sie wydaje ,ze koncowy efekt panstwa dzialalnosci i protesty . ktore wywolala- moze byc dla wielu mieszkajacych tu ludzi olbrzymim zaskoczeniem.
Ijeszcze raz Nabucco tym razem w wykonaniu publicznosci (bedzia jeszcze raz )
PROSIMY O ZWROT DZIECI DO BIOLOGICZNYCH RODZICOW
Andre Rieu – Nabucco . mp4
No i jeszcze ta sama prosba w wykonaniu Rosjan
PROSIMY ZWROCIC DZIECI
Red Army Choir – The Chorus of the Hebrew Slaves
Congratulations! May your tribe increase!
Postaramy sie nie zawiesc
Whitney Houston – I Will Always Love You 1999 Live Video HQ
Truth! Truth is important and truth has been my motivation for using so much time and effort on a language I almost had forgot to use myself. Thanks for the moivation power given in that direction.
I just wonder – is this true or not?
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I see that Mr Nygaard continues to say that readers and writers on Delight in Truth know nothing about Norway, should not have any opinion on things Norwegian in opposition to what he says is the truth, and should rather concentrate on sharing their Christian faith with him – one big carefree family together, it seems.
My comment to this is to tell you a different story, one with which I want to say thank you for REALLY sharing Christian faith, by responding when you see that there is something one can do to put it into practice when other people are in need. After all, Christian faith is not about being cosy and self-satisfied and proud, it surely implies thoughtfully making one’s faith the basis of conduct? Why would any nation bother to define itself as “Christian” if it implied nothing but narrow self-sufficiency and admiration of oneself and one’s own?
So here is what I would like to tell you:
Yesterday I was contacted by a Norwegian woman who was trying to help an immigrant. She had both written an article (it will be published in a little while), and she wanted to discuss with me what else could be done and how she could help her new friend. This immigrant lady from the Middle East had several children. They have all been taken by Barnevernet. There have been several rounds of County Committee and Court cases. Each time every one of the children says “I want to go home to mummy”. They have stood in court and cried and begged and they incessantly tell their carers the same. Nobody in the CC or the courts or in Barnevernet or among their paid helpers pays any attention. The children’s love is despised and denigrated by Norwegian society. – These children are to be Norway’s next grown-up generation?
Pani Marianno – TO IEST BARDZO WAZNA WIADOMOSC DO PANI
Nie wiem gdzie Pani mieszka ,ale podejrzewam ,ze w Bergen
Podaje dane: AL – Khidmat
alkhidmat.no mobilen 408 33 333
Bergen Moldbakken 37
5042 Bergen firstname.lastname@example.org
Leder Adnan Abbas
To biuro ma siedziby w : Oslo , Stawanger , Trondheim
To jest bardzo ciekawe biuro pogrzebowe , dzialajace od 2002 roku .Ma bardzo dobra opinie , moja rowniez.
Panowie ci obsluguja pogrzeby muslimskie , zajmuja sie tez wysylaniem zwlok do 45 krajow arabskich , jesli ktos sobie zyczy byc pochowany w kraju pochodzenia.A wiec kontakty w krajach arabskich maja ogromne , a tutaj imponujaca liste tlumaczy.
Wszystkie sprawy pokrzywdzonych kobiet z krajow arabskich prosze kierowac do nich , moze sie Pani powolac na mnie.Przetlumacza dokumenty , pomoga , naglosnia sprawe w kraju pochodzenia. pozdrawiam
Gdyby byly jakies problemy prosze do mnie zadzwonic , wie pani jak znalezc moj numer jesli zna pani moje dane.Goraco polecam wspolprace z nimi.
Marianna: Les hva jeg har skrevet under og ring til AL-KHIDMAT 408 33 333 Hvis Dere skal få problemer , da skal vi informere FIAT-IFTA .
Thank You for helping us here in Norway in our battle for change! CPS really has to be totally changed. I am totally shocked by all the stories that come to social media where CPS has taken over the care entirely without reason, and illegal.
How many rich parents (“socio-economic hight status” :not unemployed, mentally retarded, diabled and so on) are beeing reported to barnevernet in Norway by informants, neighbours or school staff for example, and cps built up a case to remove their children based on what the parents claim as false accusations, Knut Nygaard?
not disabled, sorry
You see, barnevernet and social workers (Nav) are the authorities tool for social control on the weakest, Not K.N? It’s a political desition to stop spending alot of money on welfare, by preventing new social clients by taking the children from those with low socioeconomic status and with other issues, give their children to the rich, let the rich get even richer by paying them millions to foster these children, so that these children will be well functioning adults (high socio eco status) who will pay alot of tax to the state ,and does not cost the community anything …
If you were correct, Trine, also the comments related to the Nazi system aiming to create Ubermensch were also correct…
Way back in 2000 the CPS in Bergen – all over – was separeted from the office partnership with the social services – later NAV social services. This close partnership and the same boss might have given the worries a too short distance. Today we get rather few worries from the NAV social services. Of cause there are more risks attached to families with problems of any kind, but most of the people I meet in my office hours are what I would call – common people – and I have had all kinds of people in my office – as parents – priest, police, high ranked military personel, lawyers a.s.o. Ir’s not like before when the name of the street a person lived in was a risk factor in itself.
A survey from 2009 shows that 50% of the children in barnevernet have single parents. 3 of 4 belonging to the two lowest social economic status of society.
Are “poverty” in Norway a risk to children? How poor are they really knut?
Shouldn’t barnevernet then grab 90% of the children in the world, who live in real risky poverty as well, so that they are “saved” from it’s parents into knuts loving care and his beloved barnevernet..I’m sure they can put 20 billion more a year on the table for such a good cause: to save really poor children at risk 😉 Or they could cooperate with cps in other countries and donate, if they care that much about children at risk.
Sitat: “..Nordlandsforskning med undersøkelse fra 2009 viser at 50% av barna som kommer inn i barnevernet er enslige forsørgere.
3 av 4 av familiene tilhører de to laveste sosiale/økonomiske lag i samfunnet. Driver de med utrenskning av fattigdom?..”
Her svarer jeg på mine spørsmål selv, Nygaard, lurer du på om de tok pillene sine når de foretok undersøkelsen..hva
You bring up some very interesting and important points, Trine, which leads me to the next questions; Are children in Norway only entitled to the wealthy and healthy? Have we become a sorting society in a larger context where not only babies with down syndrom, for instance are aborted, but also where babies born to parents, who, in Barnevernet`s eyes, are not healthy and wealthy enough,are being ripped away from them and placed with the healthy and wealthy?
“..Are children in Norway only entitled to the wealthy and healthy? Have we become a sorting society in a larger context where not only babies with down syndrom, for instance are aborted, but also where babies born to parents, who, in Barnevernet`s eyes, are not healthy and wealthy enough,are being ripped away from them and placed with the healthy and wealthy?..” ❤ exactly, Hildi, this is what's going on. And I will do my best to proof it, but it might take a while and a great deal of effort, unless someone here have already done that work, or knows where I should start dig?
Many of us and I guess you as well wish if there were no issues about Norwegian child welfare system even if you had much less readers then.
I wish it was about really about looking for children’s best interest by fair procedures and avoiding disproportionate measures. At not last respecting the human rights of the children…
Unfortunately this seems not to be the case — and I am pretty happy that you host our conversations on your blog!
It really is a pleasure to have you all here.
This blog is the first i have ever given my comments too. My experience is mixed,not everyone liked my Norwegian eyes on things. Especially one person seemed to want to scare me away.
From my point of view,Knut is the one who is giving this blog drive. Whitout him;there wouldn`t be so many fruitful discussions and high energy level. I think this blog has reach this number of visitores because of him and i am giving him a thumbs up because of his effort and engagement.Hurray Delight and Knut,the world does not develop without discussions.
Referring to: quote “.. A former social worker speaks out: We had lists of mothers, who we specifically targeted, single mothers, ones with children from different fathers, poor, sick, unemployed, parents or families without relatives. Anne-Kathrine Eckbo-Fangan..”
Eckbo-Fangan has never worked in a CPS office – she has been a hometeacher for some of her children.
We have documented this earlier for you, Knut N. , that Anne- Kathrine Eckbo – Fangan indeed worked for a while for Barnevernet in the past. Why are you suddenly denying the proof?
why so silent, knut..
Jasper; oh yes, the system’s aiming to create rich, healthy “Ubermensch”, exactly my point, thank you. Getting rid of the poor, sick, christians, foreigners and so on, it’s freaking me out.
It’s all about money; acquaintances, resources and status, for crying out loud.
NORWAY WAKE UP!!! We need another worldwide protest , anyone have enough socioeconomic status to light the fire? 🙂
Some of the parents we meet today regret that the CPS didn’t get much more involved when their child was young and could be helped more propriate if taken into care voluntary for a period as a help measure.
1. The parents regretting CPS not getting more involved in the past and any current systematic level issue with forced/emergency care orders do not mutually exclude each other. Both can be true.
2. Anyway: some. How many? Compared to the magnitude of some 8000-10000 care order decisions per year?
Another problem about those who now say the CPS should have intervened / interfered when they were children, is that their ideas of what would then have happened may not be realistic, to put it mildly. Wishful thinking about a life without parents being without problems has nothing much to do with the reality of life under the CPS. Just look at the statistics of how CPS children end up in all sorts of areas: frighteningly worse off not only than the average in the population, but even much worse than comparable groups who grew up with their parents.
That’s because the CPS comes in fare too late. The child involved has got some diagnoses; there is no motivation for school, the child is hurt or/and aggressive; the taste for party and drugs have entered a.s.o. – and then the CPS must take the struggle for the few last years. The parents that didn’t want any help beg us now too take as much responsibiity for the child as possible – themselves has ende up as wallpaper.
Knut, I have lost the context. Are you still talking about the same parents as before?
“That’s because the CPS comes in fare too late.”
“Too late,” Knut?
Sadly, I know that you are not kidding.
Mr Nygaard has come up with several interesting statements lately.
“That’s because the CPS comes in far[e] too late.”
This is one of the saddest lies Barnevern educators implant in their workers. It motivates them to take children at birth, claiming that if only Barnevernet interferes, then everything will go better. It also gives them an excuse every time a child does not do well in their hands: They dish out that the parents had already destroyed the child. But the results are NOT positive for foster children – not even for adopted children – and not even for children taken at birth, compared with children raised by their own parents even in very disadvantaged circumstances.
Mr Nygaard again, in another posting: “We don’t have or are interested in the statistics you ask for.”
I am sure this is true. Naturally they are not interested in statistics. The statistics resulting from their “work” are a sorry thing, so better ignore it all.
“We are a public service for all people in the municipality.”
Here we have the concentration camp statement again: ‘Wir pflegen Sie’ (We’ll take care of you.) Ordinary prisons, too, are a service for the population. The people who are subject to Barnevernet’s management, however, children and parents alike, have not deserved to have their lives destroyed in the way Barnevernet so often does.
“The child involved has got some diagnoses; there is no motivation for school, the child is hurt or/and aggressive; the taste for party and drugs have entered a.s.o. – and then the CPS must take the struggle for the few last years.”
Since when did Barnevernet understand or respect meaningful diagnoses, or understand that diagnoses (especially their own) may be totally wrong? They certainly have not given up the spurious diagnosis of Natasha as mentally retarded. They certainly trust Vilde mothers’ centre’s “diagnosis” of the “relationship” between Nadia and her son and their postulates about all that they claimed Nadia did “wrong”. Mr Nygaard has certainly stuck to all manner of “diagnoses” of these people, of the Bodnarius, and evidently believes in the inferiority of everyone about whom Barnevernet ever flings out some sort of statement.
Barnevernet’s people and doings are the very last to motivate children and young to go to school.
In many cases the CPS even prevents them from going to school, because they know that the child will run away if it has any minute away from Barnevernet’s control. Several children are driven to and from school by taxi, managed by Barnevernet, in order to prevent them from escaping. It does not exactly provide an environment to stimulate school work.
From Sweden, whose CPS is no better than Norways: http://forum.r-b-v.net/viewtopic.php?f=56&t=987)
The results are pretty clear: Individuals who have been subject to Barnevernet’s help, do far worse on practically all parametres than any group you compare them with.
What utter nonsense that Barnevernet is capable of getting youngsters off drugs. On the contrary, an impressive number of young in Barnevernet’s care START using narcotics while they are there, especially those made to live in institutions.
You forgot to draw your version of the last sentence in my comment; Skånland – “The parents that didn’t want any help beg us (the CPS) now too take as much responsibiity for the child as possible – themselves has ended up as wallpaper.” The child is no completly out of control for the parent(s) – now they finally accept their shortcomings and open the door for possible help.
In Bergen the CPS will be reorganaized the coming year. As I have told you all they who work with fosterhomes will be gathered from our eight district offices into one central office. The remaining personell – like me – will continue to work with the emergencies, the investigations and the help measures. The eight offieces doing so will be reduced to four and placed aside or togheter with the family health care center under one boss – that might be educated as a CPS or educated as a health nurse with something added.
The family health care center will then handle the more light situations for a child and do the refferal to guidance center and other measures that the CPS was the one to be alone to handle. The consequence will be that the CPS will work with the more serious situations. This alteration is meant to reduce the timeframe the child earlier had to be living under in a care situation giving serious effects for the rest of it’s life.
There are inconsistencies in your comment, Knut.
Why the reorganization? Is the Barnevernet attempting to save some of the large amounts of money it loses on an annual basis? Or, do Barnevernet managers want to consolidate to keep better control over workers who make “mistakes?”
Knut, types of reorganization like the one you have poorly described here don’t usually save much money nor are they good for most “clients.” Transportation costs become more of an issue. How many of the 1000+ annual emergency care orders will have to be enforced from Bergen? How many more parents will be farther away from children that have been taken? Visitations will be more difficult for many parents.
I hope you are wrong about this reorganization, Knut.
I don’t understand how it will “help” parents at all.
I understand that your memory is short and that you don’t read the comments well, Chris. I told you months ago about the national plan for the CPS with a timeframe hence to 2020. You can use the link below and recapitulate the earlier information in this national reform – one of the central assets is to recruit fosterparents among relatives or elsewhere in the local surroundings so the child involved may not need to change kindergarden, school or friends. That’s one reason for the gathering of all involved with fosterhomes in one office. The other reason I have also informed you about. The reseach done by the firm Deloitte that showed that our 8 districts had some differences and now we shall do our work from the same manual.
The cooperative unit wiht the family health care center is also from the national office – more cooperation around the public services done to the best for the children and the families. The family health care center give help to all – we only to the few that need something extra and in that conconsideration – that they shall get the help needed at an earlier stage than now.
I forgot the link – here it is
http://www.aftenposten.no/norge/Ny-barnevernsreform-skal-gi-barn-og-familier-tidligere-hjelp-56323b.html – A new CPS reform shak give children and families help at an earlier stage
Which parents ends up as wallpaper? (K.N.:”The parents that didn’t want any help beg us now too take as much responsibiity for the child as possible – themselves has ende up as wallpaper”) The rich ones, that barnevernet didn’t harrass for 10-15 years?
Or those who very early asked for help, and all barnevernet did was to destroy the parents if possible, and try take their children? Is it the latter example you’re referring to, children and youth who grows up seeing their parents broken by the system, who needed help, let’s say because the child(ren) had an undiagnosed illness, mistaken by barnevernet as care failure (omsorgssvikt), and no help is given, only investigation, psyhological rape, monitoring, false statements, notices of meetings every week, reports written – full of mistakes and accusations, yes hell you will not believe until you see it.
Youngsters who have seen parents become depressed and suffers from anxiety of the barnevernet, they did not dare raise his voice anymore to the kids, because then neighbors inform the authorities, cps, or dare to ask the school for help if children have problems there, then the school will report you to bv, and so on everywhere. Parents in norway are wing clipped and can not exercise their parental role and gaining respect in the home of their children longer immediately comes the fuzz with sanctions and punishment.
It is these young people who are struggling at school knut, becomes aggressive and do not regret it and will use drugs, or their parents end up as wallpaper?
Hmm – wonder whose fault it is !
“I understand that your memory is short and that you don’t read the comments well, Chris. I told you months ago about the national plan for the CPS with a timeframe hence to 2020. You can use the link below and recapitulate the earlier information in this national reform –”
I am wondering whether I should laugh or cry, Knut. I probably should cry because of this link. Instead, I will focus on the information you have shared here.
As far as your first sentence, I long ago stopped reading everything you put up as it is such a mix of things. I understand why there are some who don’t respond to you anymore. Your propaganda methods would be tiresome if someone tried to give you the benefit of the doubt and read everything and watched all the videos you put up. No one has the time that you seem to have in your effort to confuse and misinform. You appear here seven days a week and how you “work with the emergencies, the investigations and the help measures” to any great degree is beyond me.
The link you have shared is from a media source. Isn’t there anything more official you can use to communicate?
Here is a statement at the bottom of the media source:
“Aftenposten works by the Code of Ethics rules for good press”
I would like to see this “Code of Ethics” someday as time allows. Many of the Norwegian press sources that I’ve looked at have a similar statements connected to them.
So, you have chosen a media source to communicate the “plan.” Your comment to Marianne has details not included in the newspaper article linked to. Actually, your plan and the plan you’ve linked to vary greatly in detail.
“one of the central assets is to recruit fosterparents among relatives or elsewhere in the local surroundings so the child involved may not need to change kindergarden, school or friends.”
Among relatives, Knut? Are you actually saying that you and/or your employer will consider placing some of the children taken by the BV to be placed with relatives?
The media source that you linked to implies the usage of the media as a communication devise by the BV. I think Barnevernet’s own materials would be much more appropriate.
The statement (in Aftenposten) of the changes being made to “now give municipalities more responsibility for child protection” are quite disturbing. If this article caused little concern in Norway, it shows either a small distribution of this media source or a glaring example of what can happen when you have been treading water for so long. The other option I can think of is that people are generally scared to say anything against a cruel machine for any number of reasons.
Just a small part of the article linked to:
“- What is the biggest problem in child care in cooperation between municipal and state today?
“- Municipalities are finding that supply the demand for individual children are not met in a good enough way. It takes too long before the state can foster, and often we do not find the right home for the child.”
There is no statement about how simple advise or “training” would allow children to stay with their loving parents. A common sense plan like this would save so much time, money, and most importantly heartache that occurs when loving parents are separated from their children.
You write this comment, Knut:
“The reseach done by the firm Deloitte that showed that our 8 districts had some differences and now we shall do our work from the same manual.”
How many times have I asked you for a copy of a training manual, Knut?
This is something I have scanned your comments for and I haven’t seen anything to indicate an answer to my several requests. Maybe I didn’t read a comment well enough. Please correct me if it is so.
Also, I will ask the question one more time. May I please see a copy of one of the training manuals used for the training of BV personnel who work in the Parent and Child Centers (some call them Mothers’s Homes). Since your organization spends so much money each year, it must be in PDF format somewhere.
I expect the same type of answer I always get. I wish I had more time to examine your “plan” and the “plan” linked to in the media source. Anyone with common sense can read them both in very short order and come to their own conclusion.
Thank you so much Chris, now I can sleep with a smile on my face; someone out there see clearly the issues we’re facing up here ❤
* "There is no statement about how simple advise or “training” would allow children to stay with their loving parents. A common sense plan like this would save so much time, money, and most importantly heartache that occurs when loving parents are separated from their children"
* "Also, I will ask the question one more time. May I please see a copy of one of the training manuals used for the training of BV personnel who work in the Parent and Child Centers (some call them Mothers’s Homes). Since your organization spends so much money each year, it must be in PDF format somewhere"
Knut, I hope that the reorganization in Barnevernet, and taking actions earlier can help even on the short term to significantly reduce the number of forcedcare orders and emergency care orders. Acting quickly is successful only if Barnevernet can get rid of unnecessary care orders — and according to statistics there should be much less of them for a country with as many citizens as Norway.
Translated from a recent survey on barnevernet in Norway, link follows in below:
Google translated most important points, page 12
1. Child Welfare Services in Norway is based on the law of neglected children by 1896 and the law on Guardian Council Act (Vergerådsloven) of 1900 aimed at prevention of crime. Armament in order to bring up to date efforts aimed at Anti-social- and behavioral difficulties in children and adolescents have been given priority in Norway since 1996.
2. The other established fixture (innslag) in Norwegian Child Welfare are protective needs that arise when children grow up in families that lack financial and social capital, and in families where unforeseen events affects children and adolescents. The emergence of the welfare state in the postwar period made it natural to place cps in the social sciences domain, organizational rooted in social care.
3. Barnevernet is in its focus a designed product of worries and concerns about problems within families, these worries and concerns (uro og bekymringer) emerged in the seventy and eighties (på 70 og 80 tallet), and is thus a modern phenomenon.
5. Immigrant and refugee families are overrepresented clients in child welfare.
How many rich parents do barnevernet built up case against to remove their children by the blessing of the court (the barnevern law) Fylkesnemda? 0.00001 % or less, Herr Nygaard?
And if you don’t accept me referring to Eckbo-Fangan, then I refer to myself, I have 30 years expeience in listening to single mothers, and other targeted groups, and even I myself and my youngest child has been hunted (seriously targeted by the informer-system) for at lest the last 15 years from barnevernet, as I’m sure you’re well informed about..
But, please knut; My question is really important: How many rich families go through this? Any?? And, if there are a few, do they win in court?
And do you not see my point, frustration and fight for human rights for the poor, sick, unemployed (de svakere gruppene) and so on that should be helped, not broken by stealing the most precious they have, these mothers who carries their baby 9 months in their own body, the attachment is from the beginning knut.
How come the state act like the babies are the state’s and not belongs to it’s mother.. as a christian man, do you not trust God has a plan for every human beeing; what kind of mothers and fathers we get, dna, experience in life by purpose, upbringing..do you think God did so many mistakes in Norway..that His will is that the state must separate these children afrom their mothers nd brake their hearts, knut? Oh – and don’t forget Mary (miriam) mother of Yeshua (Jesus) a single mother, right? what would happen… – I think you know where I’m going.
God (Love) is removed from Norway, our culture; kindergarden, schools, homes, relationships, and barnevernet amongst alot of other evils are the price we pay.
It’s the childs situation that is our interest. We don’t have or are interested in the statistics you ask for. We are a public service for all people in the municipality.
“Some of the parents we meet today regret that the CPS didn’t get much more involved when their child was young ”
No parent in their right mind would ask such .they are complectly blinded by the facet of Barnevernet god given desire to help.The only real facet of barnevernet is TERROR under the slogan of CHILD’S BEST INTEREST.
when a child screems I want to go home and you take him the other way who’s interest you follow then.
What bussines do you have in interfering with parrents how to raise their children.Last time a checked it’s the mother that carries that baby in her womb for nine month but you sit by the opening of her legs when she gives birth an take that child away like a cold blooded monster cause you think she can’t raise that child.your society is the first to openly destroy it’s family and every Friday you and your colleagues have a great lunch.
You know about that Friday lunch? Yes, we ( our local office) start the week together and on Friday we have a great lunch togheter – we are colleagues doing a public service that is both important and stressful. When we start the week we don’t know the details for the coming days. Working with people is in general so, but the unpredictable side of the work is a daily challange. Yes, we have the focus on the childs situation.
I hope you start your week at work, Knut, with the aim to help and try to keep families together and not to destroy and tear apart. Sit down with the broken. Listen to them. Encourage. Lift up.
Spokojnie , pomozemy.
Rolig vi skal hjelpe
Powtarzamy 5 razy i zapamietujemy
Prosze oddac dzieci
Giuseppe Verdi – Nabucco – Va pensiero ( Capodanno 2013)
Here is a new video about another couple who have so unjustly had their little boy taken away by Barnevernet;
Barnevernets attrocities drives me mad! How can they get away with their cruelty towards parents who haven`t done anything to deserve being deprived of their own children? Even worse; how dare they cause such heartache in children, like here in Amy`s case, who cry and long for their mum and dad. How can Barnevernet go and just cut off every tie between a child, biological parents, relatives, country, culture etc.?
When I see all these completely normal parents, who love and care for their children, who have had them taken away, I don`t understand the world anymore. It seems like Barnevernet can take just anyone they catch. Once anyone is on their hook, for whatever reason, it is hard to get away.
It is one thing to take away children from parents, who, where we all would agree, really harm their children and won`t change. It is something quite different to take away children from parents who have good and loving parents.
The Bodnariu case was an eye-opener. We prayed and fought. The children were brought back. Now as we see more cases like this, we cannot stop praying and fighting! Because this simply needs to stop!!!!!!!
Dla osob nie znajacych sprawy : Amy Jakobsen zabrano synka poniewaz BV swierdzila u dziecka 1 kg niedowagi ,Prosze spojrzec na masywna budowe roslych Norwegow oraz – na przyklad – drobych Wietnamczykow, Tajow i innych azjatow.Chlopczyk mial normalna wage oczywiscie.Sprawa trwa dlugo , dziecko oddane zostalo do pary homoseksualnej ( jednoplciowej) i nie wrocilo do matki.Norwegowie podkreslaja swoja nowoczesnosc, ja bym raczej uzyla innego slowa – barbarzyncy.Moim zdaniem to bardzo bulwersujaca sprawa.Widac tutaj , ze Norwegowie nie przejmuja sie roznicami w budowie, uzywaja tych samych tabel dla wszystkich.
Nie znaja sie rowniez na innych roznicach.Na przyklad jedna z par stracila dziecko , bo mialo nierownomiernie rozlozony pigment na skorze.Wszyscy w tej rodzinie tak mieli , pochodzili z populacji gdzie to czesto wystepuje.Ale dla pracownika oznaczalo to jedno – siniaki .
Chris, you are a blessing to many nations (of course I mean their people) and you are a BIG voice for the defenseless and the voiceless… May God continue to use you in this endeavor, may He grow your audience by leaps and bounds and guide you to the heights He has prepared for you. This is what happens when you do all to the Glory of God and with a servant’s heart toward your fellow man. Many, many blessings to you and your family!
Thanks for the support, Rodi! You were here from the beginning of the project!
and you are a God send, all around!
Luciano Pavarotti & Cambodian and Tibetan Childrens Choir – Va Pensiero
Frekwencja na protestach .Pragne wszystkich uspokoic , ze nie beda odpytywani z roznych przypadkow.
Nie bedzie pytan np:Ile lat miala Natasza w chwili odwiedzin pracownika bv w jej pokoju , ktory podobno nie byl idealnie posprzatany.
Naprawde prosze panstwa – bez stresu.Zadnych pytan , moze ktos sie jedynie zapyta – Jak sie czujesz kiedy stajesz po wlasciwej stronie w tak waznej sprawie .
Czy trzeba znac historie Bv , sposob dzialania .Otoz mozna ,ale , nie jest to konieczne , zeby protestowac. Mozna sobie po prostu przyjsc i postac ,albo posiedziec z sympatycznymi ludzmi , ktorzy tam beda.
Goraca zapraszam ,liczy sie obecnosc ., kazdy jest mile widziany.Najlepiej przyjsc z rodzina , zabrac przyjaciol , nie ma zadnych ograniczen – ile przyjaciol wolno zabrac.Najlepiej tak duzo jak sie da.
Zucchero – Va pensiero ( Nabucco)
This blog is the first i have ever given my comments too. My experience is mixed,not everyone liked my Norwegian eyes on things. Especially one person seemed to want to scare me away.
From my point of view,Knut is the one who is giving this blog drive. Without him;there wouldn`t be so many fruitful discussions and high energy level. I think this blog has reach this number of visitores because of him and i am giving him a thumbs up because of his effort and engagement.Hurray Delight and Knut,the world does not develop without discussions.
The Cps in Norway are still one of the best.
Thanks, Topsy. I agree that that having Knut, you and others who are on the other side of the issue fuels discussion. Unfortunately, I cannot agree with your conclusion.
Witam Topsy – ciesze sie , ze cie slysze ( czytam ).
Mam ochote odpowiedziec ci w punktach:
1 Rozumiem , ze sprawa zainteresowala cie na tyle , ze wlaczylas sie do dyskusji – jak widzisz nie jest to typowa norweska reakcja ( Jak na 5 milionow mieszkancow ) ludzi zajetych sprawa Bv -duzo nie jest.
2 Rozumiem , ze zdajesz sobie sprawe, ze Twoj norweski osad sprawy jest inny niz ocena pozostalych dyskutujacych.No coz to niestety wyglada tak ,ze caly swiat ma inna ocene sytuacji niz Norwegowie ( pomijajac kilka osob takich jak np Marianna )
3 Oceniasz Knuta wysoko i twierdzisz , ze to dzieki niemu jest taka wysoka frekwencja. – no coz , tu znowu wychodzi zdolnosc Norwegow do wlasciwej oceny sytuacji.
4 Swiat nie rozwija sie bez dyskusji. -Oczywiscie .Norwegia na przyklad nie rozwija sie , poniewaz tu sie TYLKO DYSKUTUJE .
Wystepuje tu totalna niechec do podejmowania decyzji u ludzi na wysokich stanowiskach. Obojetnie o czym by sie nie rozmawialo , zawsze odpowiedzia jest …to my o tym podyskutujemy .Moim zdaniem powinno sie to zastapic odpowiedzia – my o tym zadecydujemy , albo juz rozwiazalismy ten problem ( na ogol ten problem jest stary , bo jak sie o nim tylko rozmawia to juz kazdy wie , ze on jest .tylko nie ma decyzji jak go rozwiazac).Moze tych ludzi na stanowiskach w Norwegii powinno sie informowac , ze to stanowisko jest do podejmowania dzialan , rozwiazywania problemow, decydowania.Moze oni nie wiedza ,ze maja wladze?
5 BV w Norwegii jako firma najlepsza na swiecie.-Nie , to juz naprawde przesada.
No i co spowodowalo taka frekwencje.Tam na zdjeciu jest klawiatura fortepianu – to dobra metafora.Zlozylo sie na to wiele:
1 Sprawa Norwegow mieszkancow – podobno – najlepszego miejsca do zycia -proszacych o azyl w innym kraju , w Polsce.
To juz samo w sobie powinno zainteresowac i Norwegow i Polakow.
2 Sprawa norweskiego Bv juz byli zainteresowani ludzie w wielu krajch czyli to jest kontynuacja tego zainteresowania.
3 Dobre wyszkolenie czlowieka dzialajacego w dystrybucji i jego zapal dla sprawy – czyli Oktawian.
4 Dostepnosc blogu w roznych jezykach.
5 Sprawa jest po prostu ciekawa dla wielu , bo dotyczy krzywdzenia dzieci i ich rodzicow .Nazwalabym to nawet drastycznym krzywdzeniem.
6 Ciekawi ludzie w dyskusji – podejmujacy rozne aspekty sprawy.
7 Uzywanie elementow , ktore zwiekszaja na ogol uwage jak na przyklad smieszne rysunki , czy dobra muzyka.
8 Pani Foster Jenkins – to moze nie jest dobra muzyka , ale na pewno pewien ciekawy fenomen muzyczny .Kobieta o niebywalym entuzjazmie , absolutnym braku glosu i zdolnosci dobrej oceny.
No i wyszlo dobrze , a teraz to prosze nie osiadac na laurach -tylko brac sie do roboty , bo jak zauwazylam to nie docieraja tu jeszcze ludzie z wielu krajow.Czyli jest masa roboty przed nami.
Please write your comments in English from now on, Gabriela. Thank you.
Haleluiah, Praise be to our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ.
Dzis jest w pismie Dagbladet artykul o tym ,ze za Rumunamimnie staly mafie i kryminalistow tez nie bylo wielu.
http://www.dagbladet.no/ kultur / Vi – er – mange – som – skylder – de – rumenske – tiggerne – en – unnskyldning / 60316985
Przetlumacze pozniej, nie mama teraz czasu.Przepraszam
A positive thing about the way DiT has taken up and handled child protection questions, is that it has drawn quite a bit of international information. That is what the field needs. We need a solid group of people awake in every country, to speak up when the social services in their own or other countries transgress the boundaries of helpful, useful social work.
Here is a version of some useful information which Julian Chan has posted here on DiT before:
“A comparison of the culture between Australian and Norwegian child protection (CPS)”
Interesting article in Norwegian about one County Board. Could explain differences in statistics among counties…
Another interesting article in Norwegian:
Do I understand right that many municipalities outsource child welfare almost completely, meaning that experts from such private sector companies assess the necessity of emergency placements who profit from emergency placements?
This is then a classical conflict of interests story which is not handled yet at all???
If I understand the article right, the new direction at bigger Kristiansand is pretty laudable. Better to get an expert from the neighbouring municipalities staff than from the private sector for decisions to be done by a public authority. It is OK to buy child welfare services from private sector but seems not to be OK to ask private sector to decide on what services to order.
One more interesting writing by a retired Norwegian lawyer — in Norewgian — is here: http://toreblogginfo.blogspot.hu/2016/09/3-sept-2016-behov-for-lovendring-om.html
As far as I understand, there was a milestone step made in the past days in the legal fight against abuse of authority by Barnevernet: the first (known) reported alleged crime of abuse of authority.
An interesting article in Norwegian: http://www.advokatsylte.no/barn/brakseier-for-barneverndemonstrantene
English translation on Marianne Haslev Skånland’s webpage:
Knut, you earlier made comments that you expect better quality by municipalities cooperatin in the area of child welfare.
A recent article that I have found suggests that costs are going up and about quality there is almost no information available.
in case this kind of cooperation is only a trick to take out money from the budget of municipalities and take away control and auditing from their powers — as far as I understand, the article suggests that to me — then of course such a change is not laudable at all.
I hope such topics will be transparent and got clarifications or solutions soon.
An interesting article in Norwegian, also brings some spotlight on philosophy behind Norwegian Child Welfare Act:
Interesting commentary from Mørch, Jasper. What struck me in his commentary is the phrase “sikring av barns rett till….”, or “securing of the child’s right to….” The problem here as I’ve understood in many cases is that barnevernet claim the monopoly of speaking for the children, even above the children themselves. This means that “securing the right to care and protection” is as open to interpretation as our old “barna’s beste” buzz word.
Julian, I competely agree… this is also something that goes under spotlight.
The quotes are not completely wrong, however. The problem is that the basic principle seems to be forgotten: both parents and Barnevernet are legal guardians of the child — and in case of dispute there should be an assumption at start for all sides that they want the best for the child. Then there should be a debate at court with the “equality of arms” and lots of transparency so the truth could prevail…
Shortly speaking: the major issue is not that the development principle was present in Norwegian Child Welfare Act or not — but that the human rights perspective, the fundamental rights of the children, for a fair process and for protection from unnecessary interventions are not really present, or ithey were present they are in a form that is far too easy to bypass by the authorities.
This is a severe human rights issue for the defenseless (the children themselves), not on the level of individual cases but on the level of actual Norwegian laws not respecting human rights enough.
Another interesting article in Norwegian. Lawyers suggest Barnevernet interviews use leading questions and are biased:
If they were right, it is a severe violation of children’s right for a fair procedure and children’s right for their own family (Articles 6 & 8 of European Convention for Human Rights) and hence those barnevernet procedures should be declared violating fundamental human rights of the children and should be declared null and void (including anulling foster care) — to be restarted from scratch.
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